juls
Innocent
Posts: 42 
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Post by juls on Jan 4, 2016 8:44:38 GMT -5
My girlfriend and I were wondering, after watching season 4's "Marry-Go-Round", how The Elders do not know and want to inform Leo that Cole is The Source and has been trying to ruin the wedding day all along. Don't they see everything?
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jan 4, 2016 12:49:35 GMT -5
The Elder only "saw things" when the plot required them to. Otherwise they were as useful as the old screen door on a submarine.
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juls
Innocent
Posts: 42
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Post by juls on Jan 4, 2016 14:24:17 GMT -5
Ah...so basically a flaw in the story for plot line reasons...lol
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Post by adzpower on Jan 4, 2016 14:28:24 GMT -5
The elders were absolutely useless at everything they did, completely incompetent, Lord knows how they ruled the good side of magic for however millenia.
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juls
Innocent
Posts: 42
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Post by juls on Jan 4, 2016 14:32:04 GMT -5
You guys are cracking me up...lol
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 5, 2016 1:59:31 GMT -5
One can only assume they were 'backing off' from watching over (interfering in the sisters' lives) after they vanquished the Source and so they didn't pick up on Cole's possessions. Either that or they knew Cole was destined to be possessed and vanquished so they just sat back and let the sisters figure it out for themselves.
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Post by Chrisaholic on Jan 5, 2016 10:22:06 GMT -5
The Elders were only plotted in when needed. Otherwise, they were just in the background and let the normal "work" do by the whitelighters and witches. At least, that's the impression of the later seasons.  |
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Post by erikamarie on Jan 5, 2016 14:59:44 GMT -5
Originally the Elders,only older and more experienced whitelighters, seemed wisely devoid of powers, according to the ancient rule that the ability to reflect and govern is linked to a lack of powers and human ties
More or less after the attack of the Titans - the authors'ld have done serious courses on Greek mythology - suddenly they appear powerful, and it's odd, since they weren't able to use the powers of the gods, of which thery were only guardians, so much that they had to turn into goddesses the sisters
Once silent and mysterious masters of magic, the Elders become nosy, full of demands,incredibly ignorant on the evil world but fast to throw the CO into the fray, as they were their infantry
Perhaps the wisest of them died during the Titans attack and thesurvivors, frightened, took advantage of powers that it'ld be better not use, changing and losing their wisdom
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Post by Darkhorse Christian on Jan 5, 2016 15:37:34 GMT -5
Perhaps the wisest of them died during the Titans attack and thesurvivors, frightened, took advantage of powers that it'ld be better not use, changing and losing their wisdom That's definitely a moving theory. And the season 9 comics do…kinda run with it a little, by having those Elders replaced for their constant politics by a newer and wiser set, which apparently includes Kyle Brody for some reason. |
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Post by erikamarie on Jan 6, 2016 5:01:31 GMT -5
Content to having never read the comics!
Can't stand Brody, obsessive, vengeful, a great puppetmaster
To make matters worse, that actor has something slimy in the look, I feel him physically uncomfortable
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Esmeralda
Charmed
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Post by Esmeralda on Jan 6, 2016 10:23:26 GMT -5
Content to having never read the comics! Can't stand Brody, obsessive, vengeful, a great puppetmaster To make matters worse, that actor has something slimy in the look, I feel him physically uncomfortable I find that funny, since in looks he reminded me of Cole. Brody becoming an Elder in the comics never made sense to me, but I wonder if it was done because he's one of the few characters we see become a whitelighter, even if the only reason why he did was that he was on the Elders' side as compared to Leo who did more good than any of the Elders or Brody vs. the Avatars, but was punished because he was on the Avatars' side. Part of how they definitely changed after the massacre of the Elders by the Titans. |
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Post by erikamarie on Jan 6, 2016 10:48:53 GMT -5
Mysteries of attraction!
I think Cole is sexy and Bodry....a taller Gollum
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Post by Astral Vision on Jan 6, 2016 10:54:20 GMT -5
Maybe the Elders had a bet going between each other as to how long it would take the sisters to figure out that Cole had been possessed by the Source. xD
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Post by lilchi7212 on Jan 6, 2016 17:10:41 GMT -5
My girlfriend and I were wondering, after watching season 4's "Marry-Go-Round", how The Elders do not know and want to inform Leo that Cole is The Source and has been trying to ruin the wedding day all along. Don't they see everything? The show never confirmed how omnipresent the elders actually are. In "Magic Hour" they genuinely don't know and just aren't taking any chances because of the huge risk. Also they're watching them heavily just for that specific reason. They've got more important things to worry about - hence why they only give Leo and Piper one day to think it over. As for the Cole thing, they had no reason to believe it was him. When they find out about the new Source, they assume it's a demon and therefore underground. They just didn't think that maybe it was a possessed human. |
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Esmeralda
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Post by Esmeralda on Jan 6, 2016 22:04:16 GMT -5
My girlfriend and I were wondering, after watching season 4's "Marry-Go-Round", how The Elders do not know and want to inform Leo that Cole is The Source and has been trying to ruin the wedding day all along. Don't they see everything? The show never confirmed how omnipresent the elders actually are. In "Magic Hour" they genuinely don't know and just aren't taking any chances because of the huge risk. Also they're watching them heavily just for that specific reason. They've got more important things to worry about - hence why they only give Leo and Piper one day to think it over. As for the Cole thing, they had no reason to believe it was him. When they find out about the new Source, they assume it's a demon and therefore underground. They just didn't think that maybe it was a possessed human. That's because it wasn't. It was a half-demon infected with the powers of the Source. You'd really think they'd notice that. With how important the Source is and the Hollow is, you'd think they'd start watching as soon as the Source is vanquished - and know where the powers went. But as compared to Connie's "They", Kern's Elders (the Elders were never called that before Season 3) were really stupid. I mean letting Leo and Piper get engaged just because they saved the Elders' asses. How stupid was that? |
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ljones
Whitelighter
Posts: 4,123
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Post by ljones on Jan 7, 2016 9:56:00 GMT -5
Content to having never read the comics! Can't stand Brody, obsessive, vengeful, a great puppetmaster To make matters worse, that actor has something slimy in the look, I feel him physically uncomfortable I find that funny, since in looks he reminded me of Cole. Brody becoming an Elder in the comics never made sense to me, but I wonder if it was done because he's one of the few characters we see become a whitelighter, even if the only reason why he did was that he was on the Elders' side as compared to Leo who did more good than any of the Elders or Brody vs. the Avatars, but was punished because he was on the Avatars' side. Part of how they definitely changed after the massacre of the Elders by the Titans. I never understood this fandom's hatred of Kyle Brody. I never understood it. Do you all hate him because he tried to kill Leo (who had a connection to the Avatars) in revenge for the deaths of his family? But Paige had made him realize that the Avatars was innocent and who the real killers of his family were. So, why do you still hate him? Because he had continued to view the Avatars as a threat? HE WAS RIGHT. They were a threat. He tried to tell Paige and her sisters, but they refused to believe him. Worse, they and Leo stupidly went ahead with the Avatars' scheme to change the world and caused a great deal of damage. Do you hate Kyle because he proved to be right about the Avatars and the Halliwells weren't? |
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Post by erikamarie on Jan 7, 2016 11:43:52 GMT -5
No, I don't care by no means of his relationship with the Avatars
I didn't like him as a character, apart from the instinctive impatience for the actor- I don't know the name, his attitude bothered me
Not enough to have reason to be sympathetic
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Post by lilchi7212 on Jan 7, 2016 12:37:29 GMT -5
The show never confirmed how omnipresent the elders actually are. In "Magic Hour" they genuinely don't know and just aren't taking any chances because of the huge risk. Also they're watching them heavily just for that specific reason. They've got more important things to worry about - hence why they only give Leo and Piper one day to think it over. As for the Cole thing, they had no reason to believe it was him. When they find out about the new Source, they assume it's a demon and therefore underground. They just didn't think that maybe it was a possessed human. That's because it wasn't. It was a half-demon infected with the powers of the Source. You'd really think they'd notice that. With how important the Source is and the Hollow is, you'd think they'd start watching as soon as the Source is vanquished - and know where the powers went. The Source itself is an essence of pure evil, which possesses and merges with a new host each time it is vanquished. However, the vast majority of demons is unaware of this truth, believing that each Source is a new demon risen to power. |
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Esmeralda
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Post by Esmeralda on Jan 7, 2016 13:10:15 GMT -5
That's because it wasn't. It was a half-demon infected with the powers of the Source. You'd really think they'd notice that. With how important the Source is and the Hollow is, you'd think they'd start watching as soon as the Source is vanquished - and know where the powers went. The Source itself is an essence of pure evil, which possesses and merges with a new host each time it is vanquished. However, the vast majority of demons is unaware of this truth, believing that each Source is a new demon risen to power. That's your way of interpreting what you saw. It's not mine, because it doesn't make sense with what happened. There was never any possession because Cole was always Cole. You can't be both Cole and someone else which is the definition of possession. The power of the Source kept growing stronger as he accepted and enjoyed being evil. But he wasn't possessed and the Elders should've noticed. He was influenced the same way Paige was at the beginning of the season - unlike the little boy and the mother and father in the vision Paige saw, or even Shane. Paige was still Paige. She was still making her own choices. Just like Cole. She chose good. He chose evil because he didn't like being a weak, powerless non-magical. If Phoebe has any fault in this, it's that - taking away his powers rather than learning how to love him with the powers that made him Cole. Otherwise, it's all Cole's fault. The first sign that Kern's Elders weren't the same as Burge's "They" was the fact that the Elders were stupid enough not to know about Paige and stupid enough not to know that the Source was vanquished and his powers had gone into Cole so they could tell the Charmed Ones. Nothing ever happened after that to convince me that the Elders were the same as They. I think Burge's They are the Founders mentioned in her Season One. They're omniscient and good, even if Piper thinks otherwise because They won't let her do what she wants to do. Kern's Elders are just elder whitelighters who didn't have to earn their wings in order to become whitelighters - they just had to die doing what the other Elders wanted them to do - and are anything but good. |
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Post by erikamarie on Jan 7, 2016 16:25:46 GMT -5
Omniscient and good? I'ld not so sure
In the first seasons the Elders know nothing about a lot of things, first of all the Triad
Their greatest quality is being invisible, their task'ld be to support the witch, not give orders or promise retaliation
They aren't gods or angels or something like that, only magical beings living aloof from the world and these were supposed to be instead of turning into a kind of politicians who share the cake with the evil hierarchies
In The Honeymoon's Over, Leo mentions a sort of respect to which the Elders would be forced due a sacred bond
Leo: Piper, would you... would you stop running away from me for just one minute and let me explain. (She stops and faces him.) If we got married... (she sighs) look, will you just hear me out please? If we got married, it would be a holy union, something I don't even think my bosses could break apart.
Piper: I don't understand.
Leo: It's really hard to explain. I-I don't really understand how it all works myself, but I know that there are different levels up there, a hierarchy. What I'm trying to say is that I think a holy union goes above their heads. It'd be like running an end run to my bosses bosses.
As the Source, as always the Elders do not seem to have great knowledge about him and his powers
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