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Post by jdpm1991 on Mar 31, 2016 18:02:04 GMT -5
I know Chris was the product of Holly's pregnancy but was Wyatt as well?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2016 19:01:29 GMT -5
If you mean, 'was Holly pregnant during the filming of Season 5?' then no, she was pregnant during Season 6 and at the very end of Season 8. Wyatt was a total TV pregnancy. Chris was made Piper's son at the last minute when they found out Holly was pregnant in real life, which is why Piper is wearing ponchos for like 5 episodes and then is suddenly 6 months pregnant.
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Post by Ruth Marie on Feb 27, 2017 7:17:40 GMT -5
No. But Chris certainly was, I don't believe it was planned. I often thought Chris was suppose to be the big bad, and was just pretending to be Chris Perry. Imagine the twist of Chris even going as far to plant Phoebe those future visions and seeing Wyatt has a brother, and even saying he is Piper and Leo's second child. Maybe the real second son was somebody else or a daughter, who isn't suppose to be born for a number of years.
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Post by gzv969 on Feb 27, 2017 16:04:32 GMT -5
I also thought Chris would have turned out bad but had my doubts because I also felt that the chocolate piper ate that Cole had prepared for phoebe to get her pregnant was responsible to some extent for making it possible for piper to get pregnant by the end of the season against all odds. But not being a good thing as it was designed to spawn an evil child. Hence Wyatt possibility turning evil in the future and also becoming too powerful. Though some may not agree with that theory 😊
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Post by Melinda Halliwell on Feb 27, 2017 17:08:32 GMT -5
Myself personally I think the chocolate made Piper reseptable to getting pregnant I.E. bypassed the trouble she was having conceiving.
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Post by gzv969 on Feb 27, 2017 18:16:16 GMT -5
The whole thing was odd though. Both ate the chocolate at the same time. Both thought they were pregnant around the same time but tested negative (Bite Me). But phoebe finds out she really is. 4 episodes later Piper is also. Only difference was that phoebes pregnancy was magically accelerated so it wasn't a normal one.
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Post by Ruth Marie on Feb 27, 2017 22:09:28 GMT -5
I also thought Chris would have turned out bad but had my doubts because I also felt that the chocolate piper ate that Cole had prepared for phoebe to get her pregnant was responsible to some extent for making it possible for piper to get pregnant by the end of the season against all odds. But not being a good thing as it was designed to spawn an evil child. Hence Wyatt possibility turning evil in the future and also becoming too powerful. Though some may not agree with that theory 😊 No, that theory is something that had been brought up before I think here. But I don't think it was the case. |
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Post by Assassin Witch on Feb 27, 2017 23:09:42 GMT -5
The chocolate had nothing to do with evil, it was an aphrodisiac. Just puts you in the mood. The Seer gave Phoebe a potion when she was already pregnant, that's the "evil" part (but still not evil because that's not how babies and/or evil/good is).
Piper did suffer damage that made it more difficult to become pregnant. Whatever healing abilities Leo has...could have somehow in some way blah blah helped heal her. it's not a boom and done thing, she seemed like she'd been wanting this for a while and it was a slow process.
But, all in all, no, Wyatt was not from Holly. Though Chris was. We'll never know who Chris was supposed to be, especially in the S5 finale, but we know he was not originally planned to be Wyatt's little brother. The show just seemed to think that with women in their 30s, it's time for BABY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!??!!!11!!!1!!!
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Post by Ruth Marie on Feb 27, 2017 23:20:42 GMT -5
The chocolate had nothing to do with evil, it was an aphrodisiac. Just puts you in the mood. The Seer gave Phoebe a potion when she was already pregnant, that's the "evil" part (but still not evil because that's not how babies and/or evil/good is). Piper did suffer damage that made it more difficult to become pregnant. Whatever healing abilities Leo has...could have somehow in some way blah blah helped heal her. it's not a boom and done thing, she seemed like she'd been wanting this for a while and it was a slow process. But, all in all, no, Wyatt was not from Holly. Though Chris was. We'll never know who Chris was supposed to be, especially in the S5 finale, but we know he was not originally planned to be Wyatt's little brother. The show just seemed to think that with women in their 30s, it's time for BABY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!??!!!11!!!1!!! LOL I am in my 30s and still unmarried and childless. So not all women get pregnant in their 30s. It is very common for most women to have their first child in their late 30s and pushing 40. Alyssa Milano didn't even have her first child until nearly 40 for instance. Guess Brad Kern doesn't think of everyone and had the mindset of people 50 years ago. I could see Leo's healing powers playing a role in allowing Piper to be pregnant. But even then, whitelighters are suppose to be dead, so how could they conceive a child. I guess the answer is magic. LOL But again as I pointed out before in another thread, The Seer saw a vision of Phoebe and Cole's child being very special. Before she went about making it so it could be on the side of evil. Made me think originally the prophecy of the twice blessed child was intended to be Phoebe's child. But once that changed by the Seer. It moved to Piper. A theory I had for a while. Especially given how many problems Piper had conceiving, and then she suddenly got pregnant right after Phoebe lost her child, The Angel of Destiny tells her she's pregnant. Can't be a coincidence. hmmm |
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Post by gzv969 on Feb 27, 2017 23:35:39 GMT -5
The chocolate had nothing to do with evil, it was an aphrodisiac. Just puts you in the mood. The Seer gave Phoebe a potion when she was already pregnant, that's the "evil" part (but still not evil because that's not how babies and/or evil/good is). Piper did suffer damage that made it more difficult to become pregnant. Whatever healing abilities Leo has...could have somehow in some way blah blah helped heal her. it's not a boom and done thing, she seemed like she'd been wanting this for a while and it was a slow process. But, all in all, no, Wyatt was not from Holly. Though Chris was. We'll never know who Chris was supposed to be, especially in the S5 finale, but we know he was not originally planned to be Wyatt's little brother. The show just seemed to think that with women in their 30s, it's time for BABY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!??!!!11!!!1!!! LOL I am in my 30s and still unmarried and childless. So not all women get pregnant in their 30s. It is very common for most women to have their first child in their late 30s and pushing 40. Alyssa Milano didn't even have her first child until nearly 40 for instance. Guess Brad Kern doesn't think of everyone and had the mindset of people 50 years ago. I could see Leo's healing powers playing a role in allowing Piper to be pregnant. But even then, whitelighters are suppose to be dead, so how could they conceive a child. I guess the answer is magic. LOL But again as I pointed out before in another thread, The Seer saw a vision of Phoebe and Cole's child being very special. Before she went about making it so it could be on the side of evil. Made me think originally the prophecy of the twice blessed child was intended to be Phoebe's child. But once that changed by the Seer. It moved to Piper. A theory I had for a while. Especially given how many problems Piper had conceiving, and then she suddenly got pregnant right after Phoebe lost her child, The Angel of Destiny tells her she's pregnant. Can't be a coincidence. hmmm LOL. What you said about white lighters supposed to be dead. Made me remember when phoebe and piper asked Leo that question. How he got her knocked up. On another note the tonic mixed in the chocolate wasn't just to put phoebe in the mood. It was to ensure conseption and spawn a demonic seed. Coles blood was also put in the mix making it evil. "Seer: If my fertility ritual fails, the show's over anyway. Tomorrow's harvest moon will be the one chance to impregnate your wife. The power of the moon combined with this tonic will make her fertile to a demon's seed, and override any preventative measures she's taken. Her favourite sweet? Cole: Chocolate. Seer: Then I'll mix it with the chocolate. You must feed it to her in the morning, and then finish the job when the moon is high in the night's sky. And if you succeed, the evil spawn growing inside her will influence her only for lenience so that when she does discover the truth, she will bend to your will." |
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Post by Ruth Marie on Feb 28, 2017 19:22:22 GMT -5
LOL I am in my 30s and still unmarried and childless. So not all women get pregnant in their 30s. It is very common for most women to have their first child in their late 30s and pushing 40. Alyssa Milano didn't even have her first child until nearly 40 for instance. Guess Brad Kern doesn't think of everyone and had the mindset of people 50 years ago. I could see Leo's healing powers playing a role in allowing Piper to be pregnant. But even then, whitelighters are suppose to be dead, so how could they conceive a child. I guess the answer is magic. LOL But again as I pointed out before in another thread, The Seer saw a vision of Phoebe and Cole's child being very special. Before she went about making it so it could be on the side of evil. Made me think originally the prophecy of the twice blessed child was intended to be Phoebe's child. But once that changed by the Seer. It moved to Piper. A theory I had for a while. Especially given how many problems Piper had conceiving, and then she suddenly got pregnant right after Phoebe lost her child, The Angel of Destiny tells her she's pregnant. Can't be a coincidence. hmmm LOL. What you said about white lighters supposed to be dead. Made me remember when phoebe and piper asked Leo that question. How he got her knocked up. On another note the tonic mixed in the chocolate wasn't just to put phoebe in the mood. It was to ensure conseption and spawn a demonic seed. Coles blood was also put in the mix making it evil. "Seer: If my fertility ritual fails, the show's over anyway. Tomorrow's harvest moon will be the one chance to impregnate your wife. The power of the moon combined with this tonic will make her fertile to a demon's seed, and override any preventative measures she's taken. Her favourite sweet? Cole: Chocolate. Seer: Then I'll mix it with the chocolate. You must feed it to her in the morning, and then finish the job when the moon is high in the night's sky. And if you succeed, the evil spawn growing inside her will influence her only for lenience so that when she does discover the truth, she will bend to your will." Same here, exactly what I thought when making my message.  Aww yes that is correct. |
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Post by charmedforlife28 on Feb 28, 2017 19:37:13 GMT -5
Wasn't Holly actually pregnant at the same time Piper would be with Wyatt?
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Post by Ruth Marie on Feb 28, 2017 19:56:16 GMT -5
Wasn't Holly actually pregnant at the same time Piper would be with Wyatt? No, that was during season 6 for Holly's first child. The reason being Piper had two episodes were she wasn't even pregnant in the alternate world and when Leo was pregnant due to a Dream Spell. But I can understand the confusion. |
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Post by Assassin Witch on Feb 28, 2017 20:25:34 GMT -5
So then, by that dialogue, it's not just making her horny but null-and-voiding any contraceptives she might be using (like birth control). "Demon's seed" is just Cole's sperm. Or if anything about the Source influences it.
Either way, none of that leads to Piper/Leo's baby being evil because of the chocolate. It's just an aphrodisiac. "Demon seed" is stupid because that's not how people are born. She gets pregnant and they raise the baby, who would be part demon, to follow the "evil ways."
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Post by gzv969 on Feb 28, 2017 22:53:35 GMT -5
So then, by that dialogue, it's not just making her horny but null-and-voiding any contraceptives she might be using (like birth control). "Demon's seed" is just Cole's sperm. Or if anything about the Source influences it. Either way, none of that leads to Piper/Leo's baby being evil because of the chocolate. It's just an aphrodisiac. "Demon seed" is stupid because that's not how people are born. She gets pregnant and they raise the baby, who would be part demon, to follow the "evil ways." Your probably right. My concern was with coles blood being mixed in the tonic but that's probably just to ensure the potion worked |
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Post by Assassin Witch on Feb 28, 2017 23:23:35 GMT -5
From the dialogue posted above, doesn't mention anything about Cole's blood. I haven't watched that in years, so I have no idea about that part of the potion. But blood doesn't seem like it should do anything.
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Post by gzv969 on Feb 28, 2017 23:53:35 GMT -5
From the dialogue posted above, doesn't mention anything about Cole's blood. I haven't watched that in years, so I have no idea about that part of the potion. But blood doesn't seem like it should do anything. The dialogue right after is with The Seer bringing out a knife and cole giving her his hand and she cuts it over the brewing tonic and the blood drops into the potion and she says "for the Tonic". But yes it probably only just ensures the magic and strength of the tonic. Been watching too many vampire movies lately with the Underworld series where the mixing and drinking of blood seems to give other vampires others abilities and strenghts. LOL |
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Post by Assassin Witch on Feb 28, 2017 23:58:06 GMT -5
Thanks for the refresher.
It is annoying that this was never addressed. Like the show forgot this plot device. But the fans never do. This debate about the chocolates has been around since since it happened. And we'll never know.
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Post by lordumbrex on Mar 1, 2017 0:44:43 GMT -5
I always just assumed or head-canoned it that Wyatt took over Phoebe and Cole's son's destiny, so because that son was said to potentially be a great force of good if the couple had married under normal circumstances, Wyatt is generally good but still can be swayed to an evil destiny under the right circumstances. The chocolate acted as an escape clause for the child, allowing the destiny to transubstantiate into Piper, which is why her being pregnant seemed so sudden after all the previous drama. Whether he is literally the soul of that potential child or just the destiny, since he was a bit premature, I don't know, but that's how I always reasoned it out. It takes a couple of great leaps to get there, so the idea isn't for everyone, but that's how I reasoned it, which is why Cole is always a bit protective of Wyatt in my fanfiction.
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Post by sol on Mar 2, 2017 2:20:02 GMT -5
The prophecy didn't speak of a being good or evil but only of a child born from magic, for this reason the Seer tries to make Phoebe's son evil through the potion and the Crone is interested in Wyatt
I'm sure that Phoebe and Cole's son - are we sure he'ld be a male? - would be born on the day in which Wyatt is born, with 6 weeks in advance
About Holly pregnancy
From the start of the season, even if Chris's character is very ambiguous, the writers point out not only a knowledge between the two but also a future dangerousness of Wyatt
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