forbuss
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Post by forbuss on Sept 20, 2020 1:26:25 GMT -5
Please consider this the official master thread on the power Phoebe got in season six.
Did this power make sense for Phoebe? Was it related to her Premonition power? Should she have gotten a different power, or should she have not received another power in the show? Should she have gotten a different power? If so, which one? Did you like how they used this power? Should Phoebe have been able to reflect other peoples powers via empathy? Would you have rather saw a huge advancement in her premonition power, akin to The Seer?
Discuss!
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Esmeralda
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Post by Esmeralda on Sept 20, 2020 20:20:08 GMT -5
I think most of us agree that Prue should've gotten levitation and Phoebe should've gotten astral projection. For me, that and Piper getting the power to speed up time so she can see what's going to happen in the near-future rather than farther in the future like Phoebe's premonition would be more than enough, especially if Paige's power to move things with her mind was just like Chris', which was just like Prue's. I'd prefer her not getting any whitelighter-affected power - all of them just made getting rid of bad guys too easy and boring.
Especially with how Phoebe misused her original power, I don't think she should've gotten her third power. They blew it showing her with that power in 'Morality Bites'.
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Post by Too Much Coffee on Sept 20, 2020 20:54:50 GMT -5
I think most of us agree that Prue should've gotten levitation and Phoebe should've gotten astral projection. For me, that and Piper getting the power to speed up time so she can see what's going to happen in the near-future rather than farther in the future like Phoebe's premonition would be more than enough, especially if Paige's power to move things with her mind was just like Chris', which was just like Prue's. I'd prefer her not getting any whitelighter-affected power - all of them just made getting rid of bad guys too easy and boring. Especially with how Phoebe misused her original power, I don't think she should've gotten her third power. They blew it showing her with that power in 'Morality Bites'. Couldn't agree more with you Es. I don't really like them getting second powers, and rather they let their original powers grow, but if they did it you suggested here, I'd be fine with that.
What I found boring, was how much whitelighter powers took the fun out of the show, Leo or Paige can orb everyone to safety and or Leo with their injuries always being completely healed, which killed any suspence for me.
One thing, that I hated was when any sister got a new power, their original powers were an after thought and barely used. Phoebe using empathy to read people, than just using her premontions to figure it out, again killed any suspence. I don't think Phoebe's premonitions, were even used as much by Season 5 or 6, apart from maybe below 5 episodes.
Be interesting if someone had a tally or chart showing how much their powers were used as the show progressed, I'll bet Paige orbing and Piper using her powers to explode demons were the most used powers in S5-S8 over any of the others.
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forbuss
Witch
currently watching season seven
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Post by forbuss on Sept 20, 2020 22:42:35 GMT -5
I think most of us agree that Prue should've gotten levitation and Phoebe should've gotten astral projection. For me, that and Piper getting the power to speed up time so she can see what's going to happen in the near-future rather than farther in the future like Phoebe's premonition would be more than enough, especially if Paige's power to move things with her mind was just like Chris', which was just like Prue's. I'd prefer her not getting any whitelighter-affected power - all of them just made getting rid of bad guys too easy and boring. Especially with how Phoebe misused her original power, I don't think she should've gotten her third power. They blew it showing her with that power in 'Morality Bites'. Couldn't agree more with you Es. I don't really like them getting second powers, and rather they let their original powers grow, but if they did it you suggested here, I'd be fine with that. What I found boring, was how much whitelighter powers took the fun out of the show, Leo or Paige can orb everyone to safety and or Leo with their injuries always being completely healed, which killed any suspence for me.
One thing, that I hated was when any sister got a new power, their original powers were an after thought and barely used. Phoebe using empathy to read people, than just using her premontions to figure it out, again killed any suspence. I don't think Phoebe's premonitions, were even used as much by Season 5 or 6, apart from maybe below 5 episodes.
Be interesting if someone had a tally or chart showing how much their powers were used as the show progressed, I'll bet Paige orbing and Piper using her powers to explode demons were the most used powers in S5-S8 over any of the others.
Someone has a estimated premonition count per season: I tend to agree with you both though. I never understood really any of the advancements - why did Prue get AP so early when the others didn't? Phoebe and Piper got their second power in season three. I think it would have been nice to see them gain more mastery over the powers they did have vs random ones thrown in. However - I did like Phoebe's empathy because I did understand as an extension of her premonition power - it wasn't on the opposite end of the spectrum like Piper freezing/Blowing things up. Plus, I really liked seeing how the power interfered with their relationship as sisters and caused stress - much like Pipers exploding caused so much stress in season three. I recently rewatched season eight and their powers are barely used. Billie and Christie use their powers a lot, and Paige orbs a lot. That's basically it. |
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Post by Too Much Coffee on Sept 21, 2020 23:55:00 GMT -5
Couldn't agree more with you Es. I don't really like them getting second powers, and rather they let their original powers grow, but if they did it you suggested here, I'd be fine with that. What I found boring, was how much whitelighter powers took the fun out of the show, Leo or Paige can orb everyone to safety and or Leo with their injuries always being completely healed, which killed any suspence for me.
One thing, that I hated was when any sister got a new power, their original powers were an after thought and barely used. Phoebe using empathy to read people, than just using her premontions to figure it out, again killed any suspence. I don't think Phoebe's premonitions, were even used as much by Season 5 or 6, apart from maybe below 5 episodes.
Be interesting if someone had a tally or chart showing how much their powers were used as the show progressed, I'll bet Paige orbing and Piper using her powers to explode demons were the most used powers in S5-S8 over any of the others.
Someone has a estimated premonition count per season: Thanks so much. This is exactly what I wanted to see. I can't believe S6 only had three, actually I can, since as I said earlier in another reply, whenever a sister got a new power, their old powers were barely used and not important.
After S1 and S2, they really were not as important no more.
[/quote] I never got why, and really wanted to see them master their original ones Prue's grew naturally during S1, with through her eyes, then through her hands near the end of S1.
I can see how that power could work as an extension, just the worst part was when she used it to channel other demons powers in order to vanquish them, one of the worse parts of S6.
That is upsetting to hear, that their powers are barely used in S8, and that Billie and Christy used them so much and of course overusing Paige orbing. If budget was a reason, I get that, but I'd prefer them doing less orbing if it means Piper and Phoebe's powers are used more.
Since Phoebe only had three premonitions in S8, does that mean, Phoebe didn't use any other powers in S8.
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forbuss
Witch
currently watching season seven
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Post by forbuss on Sept 22, 2020 1:58:03 GMT -5
Someone has a estimated premonition count per season: That is upsetting to hear, that their powers are barely used in S8, and that Billie and Christy used them so much and of course overusing Paige orbing. If budget was a reason, I get that, but I'd prefer them doing less orbing if it means Piper and Phoebe's powers are used more. Since Phoebe only had three premonitions in S8, does that mean, Phoebe didn't use any other powers in S8.
Yeah, no powers really. Next time I watch I will note Pipers power count. It's not many! |
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Post by Melinda Halliwell on Sept 22, 2020 4:43:05 GMT -5
Not really because I thought it made her overpowered like Piper in terms of channelling powers back negating the need for the power of three and the fact she barely had any premonitions season 6 it was as of her first power was just totally forgotten obviously.
I understood the theory of deflecting attacks being that powers were affected by emotions but I don't think Phoebe should've done that then.
Like other members here Phoebe either should've had her first power progressed more throughout the years or got astral projection instead of levitation as her second power because that fitted her first one better I think but if her empathy power had to be featured then a natural order of that I would've liked is.
- Feeling emotions.
- Channel what other people feel.
- Heal people emotionally and not physical wounds.
- Make someone feel what she does by projecting her emotion onto them but not in the way she used it on Cal Greene then.
- Shield herself from feeling others emotions which she'd only use if she found someone annoying or used against enemies who had empathy too and used that to attack her mentally.
I thought Phoebe feeling emotions would've made her more sensitive to premonitions and within those visions feel a lot more than when she first got her original power actually.
Another way both powers could've connected is if Phoebe seeing an innocent felt a strong emotion towards them which triggered a vision without her touching that person or something belonging to them being a way her premonition power could've progressed further as well.
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Post by Assassin Witch on Sept 22, 2020 18:03:34 GMT -5
I understood the theory of deflecting attacks being that powers were affected by emotions but I don't think Phoebe should've done that then. Honestly, I don't understand this theory of how her power worked. That's not empathy. Not just because we saw an Empath in season three. For me, using/deflecting someone's powers back at them is a totally separate power. But hey. It's Brad Kern. |
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Post by Katie Warren on Sept 22, 2020 18:33:08 GMT -5
I understood the theory of deflecting attacks being that powers were affected by emotions but I don't think Phoebe should've done that then. Honestly, I don't understand this theory of how her power worked. That's not empathy. Not just because we saw an Empath in season three. For me, using/deflecting someone's powers back at them is a totally separate power. But hey. It's Brad Kern. Me either, I don't understand they are not related in any way. But when does the show have logic with how powers work. It's always whatever works for the story or whatever episode they are writing at the time.  |
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Post by Too Much Coffee on Sept 22, 2020 21:13:13 GMT -5
Yeah, no powers really. Next time I watch I will note Pipers power count. It's not many! Thanks.  I won't not surprised if it wasn't many at all, I'll bet Piper's freezing power is barely used if at all over her other power. |
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Post by virgowitch on Sept 25, 2020 2:39:23 GMT -5
Yes and no. In theory Phoebe becoming an empath was a good idea, but the execution was horrendous. I think I would’ve preferred Phoebe becoming a Psylocke type in terms of her abilities. Phoebe being able to see the future, read emotions and shoot psychic energy blasts would’ve made sense for her character and explained her abilities in Morality Bites. Levitation was totally unnecessary and was pretty redundant given Prue could achieve a similar effect with her TK and Paige was later able to hover as her white lighter ability expanded, making Phoebe’s levitation seem redundant.
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Post by shay321 on Sept 25, 2020 4:25:14 GMT -5
Hello everyone, i hadn’t log in for a long period and now because of the quarantine i found interest again in reading other positive thoughts
Mostly i like paige but phoebe was my number one before paige's entrance so
Generally i liked phoebe with empathy, she was as powerful as her sisters in season6 and was able to protect herself without screaming for help. It was a logic expansion of her psychic powers. Charmed powers are based on development about powers, not in who's character suits better.
Phoebe was the best empath because of her job and as usual powers are tight to emotions. To begin with 1x20 phoebe started feeling emotions though visions then followed by 2x02, (where she took her lesson) as a logical expansion of her psychic power. The succumbus episode, her first empathic connection where she actually put in practice herself being consumed by feelings (and enduring it well), was a foreshadow about what's yet to come . I'll let the Bo episode out of this because it was a psychic echo although if anyone could connect with innocents knowing about ghosts that would be phoebe.
Yet another perfect example of her astral premonitions overtaking her by feelings, the sandman gave her nightmares which made her scream from fear like someone was trying to get her guts out. Last, the fact that Leo gave her aphrodite's powers showing that's they most appropriate person to understand feelings such as love, her job exactly.
I liked melinda's theory so much, her second argument specially ''triggered a vision without her touching'' reminds me when phoebe actually had a premonition in primrose empath because of the psychic energy she felt when she walked in the room where vinceres was locked up, that would be another great way to expand her power.
(Shield herself from feeling others emotions which she'd only use if she found someone annoying or used against enemies who had empathy too and used that to attack her mentally. Another way both powers could've connected is if Phoebe seeing an innocent felt a strong emotion towards them which that person or something belonging to them being a way her premonition power could've progressed further as well)
Lastly i would like to say im so sad writers neglected phoebe after season2 and i cant help but believe that shannen doherty was the one who rushed the whole ''the power of prue'' theory. We all can see the drastic over-acting she's doing to stand out more. There are rumors about the actress’s behind the scenes demands and you can't help but believe them when you see how the change in her character matches with what those demands allegedly were. If the writers were more focused on their job and not affected by actors i feel that charmed would be loved after season5 from all of its fans because honestly there were three objectively damn fine seasons so i dont think that the show's creator was a nostrum for latter seasons (imo). Writers write and actresses act (a small reference to those of you you have seen a blooper video with shannen saying ‘’I didnt write this, obviously ’’).And this goes on and on with shannen wanting combat skill so who can say for sure that she wasnt the cause to rush things? thats why phoebe never got astral projection
I saw some xena fans here too so i want to take this opportunity and relate two characters, y'all remember alti? The evil shamaness who cursed xena's son and had the power to make people relive painful memories to degree that can kill them (like phoebe’s psychic reflection)? Alti was an improved version of phoebe and what phoebe could actually be if the writers were free to do their jobs without innervations, alti was an evil phoebe. Those two share the same psychic powers so since we know what alti was capable of doing combining visions and astral projection just imagine what phoebe could do with empathy and premonition against villains like the genie, rick or Jason, I mean she could use her empathy through premonitions to make him feel her side of view. Damn shame.
Conclusion: phoebe was always helpful and her empath power had so many potentials
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forbuss
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Post by forbuss on Sept 25, 2020 22:16:11 GMT -5
best empath because of her job and as usual powers are tight to emotions. To begin with 1x20 phoebe started feeling emotions though visions I think this is a really strong point and one that is often ignored when discussing Phoebe's powers in general - that she had shown the ability to feel others strong emotions through her premonitions. I sortof wish they had of kept building her powers like this consistently from the beginning. I so desperately wanted more premonitions like her last one, which wasn't really a premonition. It was essentially her astral projecting into the future: www.youtube.com/watch?v=YqG5rjwppJ0I really wish they had of used premonitions more in season seven and eight. It seems like the cheapest effect? But maybe filming another scene would cost more or something. |
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Post by prudencehalliwell on Sept 25, 2020 22:34:54 GMT -5
best empath because of her job and as usual powers are tight to emotions. To begin with 1x20 phoebe started feeling emotions though visions I think this is a really strong point and one that is often ignored when discussing Phoebe's powers in general - that she had shown the ability to feel others strong emotions through her premonitions. I sortof wish they had of kept building her powers like this consistently from the beginning. I so desperately wanted more premonitions like her last one, which wasn't really a premonition. It was essentially her astral projecting into the future: www.youtube.com/watch?v=YqG5rjwppJ0I really wish they had of used premonitions more in season seven and eight. It seems like the cheapest effect? But maybe filming another scene would cost more or something. I do too, I hated how premonitions was barely used later on. It annoyed me greatly, I know lots of fans love the extra powers, but once they get new ones, they ignore the older ones so much. I really think they could have just used orbing less, if that saved budget money. I'm surprised that they could afford to use orbing in almost every episode (actually, I'm pretty sure orbing was used all the time with Leo, Paige and Chris). But, I don't think premonitions is actually that expensive, like, it doesn't require much budget power, it's really Alyssa's acting to receive one, and then the actual vision is in black and white. Just the writers not bothering to use it, and or, using the sisters other powers all the time. |
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forbuss
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currently watching season seven
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Post by forbuss on Sept 25, 2020 22:37:47 GMT -5
I think this is a really strong point and one that is often ignored when discussing Phoebe's powers in general - that she had shown the ability to feel others strong emotions through her premonitions. I sortof wish they had of kept building her powers like this consistently from the beginning. I so desperately wanted more premonitions like her last one, which wasn't really a premonition. It was essentially her astral projecting into the future: www.youtube.com/watch?v=YqG5rjwppJ0I really wish they had of used premonitions more in season seven and eight. It seems like the cheapest effect? But maybe filming another scene would cost more or something. I do too, I hated how premonitions was barely used later on. It annoyed me greatly, I know lots of fans love the extra powers, but once they get new ones, they ignore the older ones so much. I really think they could have just used orbing less, if that saved budget money. I'm surprised that they could afford to use orbing in almost every episode (actually, I'm pretty sure orbing was used all the time with Leo, Paige and Chris). But, I don't think premonitions is actually that expensive, like, it doesn't require much budget power, it's really Alyssa's acting to receive one, and then the actual vision is in black and white. Just the writers not bothering to use it, and or, using the sisters other powers all the time. I think you're right. Piper could essentially vanquish any demon coming at her unexpectedly, without the need for Phoebe to have a premonition to guide them to helping. Maybe the real reason Phoebe got less premonitions is because there were less innocents. |
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Post by prudencehalliwell on Sept 25, 2020 23:25:28 GMT -5
I do too, I hated how premonitions was barely used later on. It annoyed me greatly, I know lots of fans love the extra powers, but once they get new ones, they ignore the older ones so much. I really think they could have just used orbing less, if that saved budget money. I'm surprised that they could afford to use orbing in almost every episode (actually, I'm pretty sure orbing was used all the time with Leo, Paige and Chris). But, I don't think premonitions is actually that expensive, like, it doesn't require much budget power, it's really Alyssa's acting to receive one, and then the actual vision is in black and white. Just the writers not bothering to use it, and or, using the sisters other powers all the time. I think you're right. Piper could essentially vanquish any demon coming at her unexpectedly, without the need for Phoebe to have a premonition to guide them to helping. Maybe the real reason Phoebe got less premonitions is because there were less innocents. That's right, Piper basically became the power of one, without needing help from Phoebe or Paige to vanquish demons so many times. Say what you want about Prue, as the leader, but she never had the power to vanquish demons on her own, and still needed her sisters help. I wished Piper's power only kept demons at bay, but never let her actually vanquish them. I think you might be right, when innocents were less important so where the premonitions. I noticed in the stats, a huge drop occurs from S2 to S3, when Innocents started to become less and less. |
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forbuss
Witch
currently watching season seven
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Post by forbuss on Sept 26, 2020 8:43:10 GMT -5
I think you're right. Piper could essentially vanquish any demon coming at her unexpectedly, without the need for Phoebe to have a premonition to guide them to helping. Maybe the real reason Phoebe got less premonitions is because there were less innocents. That's right, Piper basically became the power of one, without needing help from Phoebe or Paige to vanquish demons so many times. Say what you want about Prue, as the leader, but she never had the power to vanquish demons on her own, and still needed her sisters help. I wished Piper's power only kept demons at bay, but never let her actually vanquish them. I think you might be right, when innocents were less important so where the premonitions. I noticed in the stats, a huge drop occurs from S2 to S3, when Innocents started to become less and less. Was there *any* instances of Prue vanquishing a demon alone? Like using her TK to throw a knife (or anything) and vanquish them? Or using her TK to send an energy ball back at a demon, vanquishing them? I remember Paige doing a few times but I'm not sure if Prue ever did. |
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Post by prudencehalliwell on Sept 26, 2020 8:59:56 GMT -5
That's right, Piper basically became the power of one, without needing help from Phoebe or Paige to vanquish demons so many times. Say what you want about Prue, as the leader, but she never had the power to vanquish demons on her own, and still needed her sisters help. I wished Piper's power only kept demons at bay, but never let her actually vanquish them. I think you might be right, when innocents were less important so where the premonitions. I noticed in the stats, a huge drop occurs from S2 to S3, when Innocents started to become less and less. Was there *any* instances of Prue vanquishing a demon alone? Like using her TK to throw a knife (or anything) and vanquish them? Or using her TK to send an energy ball back at a demon, vanquishing them? I remember Paige doing a few times but I'm not sure if Prue ever did. Oh your right about that, there may have been some. I guess I was thinking instances where the sisters all used their powers as a team not just one using her to vanquish demons while the other's don't contribute at all if that makes sense. I remember Prue used TK to send something back to a demon was the demon in the Devils Music but that was a potion that spiled on Phoebe's skirt that she used to TK to throw the skirt onto the demon. Doesn't count I suppose. No wait, Deja Vu with using her TK to send an energy ball back to vanquish Rodriguez. The only time I recall her doing that. |
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forbuss
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Post by forbuss on Sept 27, 2020 0:26:06 GMT -5
Was there *any* instances of Prue vanquishing a demon alone? Like using her TK to throw a knife (or anything) and vanquish them? Or using her TK to send an energy ball back at a demon, vanquishing them? I remember Paige doing a few times but I'm not sure if Prue ever did. Oh your right about that, there may have been some. I guess I was thinking instances where the sisters all used their powers as a team not just one using her to vanquish demons while the other's don't contribute at all if that makes sense. I remember Prue used TK to send something back to a demon was the demon in the Devils Music but that was a potion that spiled on Phoebe's skirt that she used to TK to throw the skirt onto the demon. Doesn't count I suppose. No wait, Deja Vu with using her TK to send an energy ball back to vanquish Rodriguez. The only time I recall her doing that. I definitely remember Paige doing that a LOT more than Prue ever did. Honestly, it's not the fact that Piper got the power that bugs me, because I actually like the power. But I wish it had of just been an offensive power, now a power that could vanquish upper level demons. I wish it had of been used like Prue's TK - can fend the demon off long enough for them to vanquish with the power of three. You know? If it had just of hurt demons and knocked them back it would have been much better. Because this is what really made Phoebe's power not crucial, when I think it was the most powerful in seasons 1-2. We didn't see any other witches with this power (other than Melinda Warren), and "foresight" was an extremely rare and powerful power in the demon world. Honestly, I loved Phoebe premonitions so much - it's by far my favourite power. Phoebe was often the one to start them off with a premonition, and she often figured the solution out. Again, I like the power of empathy. But I wished they had of grown it slowly. Maybe we didn't see the extension of empathy to "reflect powers" or use a persons powers against them via empathy premiere until season seven or eight, you know? |
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Post by wyatt23 on May 3, 2023 19:17:21 GMT -5
I think that their new powers come from there real life. Prue being always busy, she needed 2 of herself. Piper easily angered can blow stuff up. And Phoebe with her advice colum, needed to help her readers better. I could see an agruement for that being personal gain, but I don't think it is because she was using that power to help other innocents maybe not from demons, but inner demons. I also did like Phoebe getting empathy because the power from season 2, was any extension of empathy and without empathy she couldn't of gotten that power.
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