Piper3
Whitelighter
Posts: 2,815
|
Post by Piper3 on Sept 25, 2008 14:57:57 GMT -5
Everyone says Cole was truely evil and he could never be good because he was the source. But, he had the chance to be good again, he was going to give his powers to the wizard but Phoebe came in and stopped him.
|
|
Esmeralda
Charmed
S2 "What If...?"
Fan Fic Winner
Twenty Years Gone....But Never Forgotten.
Posts: 21,920 
|
Post by Esmeralda on Sept 25, 2008 15:22:12 GMT -5
I would say it was the Seer's fault...
|
|
ljones
Whitelighter
Posts: 4,123
|
Post by ljones on Sept 25, 2008 18:14:51 GMT -5
I would say it was the Seer's fault... The Seer and the old Source are to blame. Cole didn't help matters by agreeing to use the Hollow in order to help the Halliwells in the first place. |
|
|
|
Post by SEERofCHAOS on Sept 25, 2008 19:07:57 GMT -5
Phoebe wouldn't have turned evil if it wasn't for the Seer. And I think it has little or nothing to do with the old Source. It is all the Seer. I loved when she got vanquished. It is what you get for seeing everything and anything, you peeping tom.
|
|
Esmeralda
Charmed
S2 "What If...?"
Fan Fic Winner
Twenty Years Gone....But Never Forgotten.
Posts: 21,920
|
Post by Esmeralda on Sept 25, 2008 20:32:39 GMT -5
Chaos Barbas, I would *so* love to know what you think of my fic Friendship...and the Seer. It also gives my answer as to what happened to Cole's parents... |
|
|
|
Post by foxfire on Sept 26, 2008 8:13:05 GMT -5
When you boil it down, it's really just Cole's fault. Yes, the Seer manipulated things but ultimately it was Cole's decisions that led to his becoming the Source. The Seer didn't make him do anything... he chose to do what he did. Just like Phoebe chose to become the QotU.
|
|
ljones
Whitelighter
Posts: 4,123
|
Post by ljones on Sept 26, 2008 11:30:33 GMT -5
I have to agree that Cole is intially responsible. He was the one who chose to use the Hollow in order to help the sisters. But I think that he had allowed his emotions to get the best of him . . . and ended up making the wrong choice.
But the Seer and the Source have to take some responsibility. The Seer knew she was setting up Cole. And instead of moving on to whatever dimension, the Source (in spirit form) decided to take advantage of Cole by possessing the latter's body.
As for Phoebe "turning evil", she is responsible for her own decision.
|
|
|
|
Post by whitelightertony on Sept 27, 2008 2:13:18 GMT -5
In fairness to Cole, he couldn't have anticipated The Source possessing his body. And even if he did, Cole wouldn't have wanted The Source to continue to exist in The Source's demonic body (with amped-up powers) from which The Source would have continued to kill innocent people.
|
|
|
|
Post by foxfire on Sept 28, 2008 0:49:52 GMT -5
I think he would have known... he was around how many years? 200. I'd assume by then he would have understood BOTH the Seer and the Source's intentions. Cole knows the Source better than anyone (except maybe the Seer) so I think he knew what he was getting himself into.
I think Cole's logic a lot of the time tends to be "I'll try and do whatever now, and deal with the consequences later. I'm powerful enough to overcome anything [power taking form in his love for Phoebe or in demonic powers]."
|
|
|
|
Post by whitelightertony on Sept 28, 2008 1:45:39 GMT -5
Honestly, I don't think Cole was thinking that far ahead. All he knew was he wanted to save/protect Phoebe and her sisters. He seemed to run into the attic half-cocked (as Natalie would say)...and he had no way of knowing he'd be interrupting that specific point of the battle.
For all Cole knew, the Halliwells were already dead...there was simply no evidence to suggest to him that he was a logical candidate for The Source to possess.
|
|
|
|
Post by imcharmed9654 on Sept 28, 2008 15:15:33 GMT -5
Honestly i think Cole should of told phoebe that the seer had tricked him in becoming the source when she had asked him. i think she would of found a way to save him with or with out her sisters help. n then when the wizard wanted to take his powers it would of been there way out n then they would of lived happy. cuz then the sisters could of vanquished the wizard n they wouldn't have to deal with the source till the 8th season i believe when he wasn't even a threat then anyways. thats just my opinion.
|
|
Piper3
Whitelighter
Posts: 2,815
|
Post by Piper3 on Sept 28, 2008 20:18:44 GMT -5
I don't see how anyone can blame Cole for what happened. He never asked to be the source and when he was it he tried to give it up. It was the Seers fault.
|
|
|
|
Post by foxfire on Sept 29, 2008 13:56:23 GMT -5
Cole and Phoebe wouldn't have stayed together even if he hadn't become the new Source. They're simply passion and passion doesn't translate into happily ever after... if there's anything that "Centenial Charmed" taught us was that no matter what reality you go into, Cole and Phoebe just don't mix. Oil and water (heaven and hell) like Phoebe says of her sisters and Cole in "Womb Raider".
|
|
ljones
Whitelighter
Posts: 4,123
|
Post by ljones on Sept 29, 2008 22:06:28 GMT -5
Frankly, that sounds more like Phoebe and Coop, than Phoebe and Cole.
There is no such thing as happily ever after. It certainly wasn't for Piper and Leo. They thought that because they had "true love", everything was going to turn out peachy keen, once they exchanged wedding rings. Well, they found out differently. Didn't they?
People think that because Phoebe married a Cupid and he comes across as inherently good, she got a happily ever after.
If Coop is an embodiment of Love . . . then he is the ebodiment of both the positive and negative aspects of Love. One day, Phoebe will find out that Coop was no more a guarantee for happily ever after than Cole was.
Love is not something that is safe. This is one lesson that the Halliwells never learned. They were always looking for "the perfect guy" or a guarantee that they'll never encounter any problems when it came to finding love. Is it any wonder that as characters, they never truly developed. Or should I say . . . matured? Phoebe never did.
|
|
|
|
Post by foxfire on Oct 6, 2008 18:50:40 GMT -5
This is interesting, in my mythology class we've been discussing love and I even did a seminar on the Hymn to Aphrodite. To the Greeks, they viewed love (eros = passion/love) is dangerous and something to be afraid of. And I think that kind of dangerous love really applies to the Charmed Ones.
Marriage doesn't guarantee "happily ever after" and true love may or may not exist. What we do know is that love isn't always going to be diamonds and flowers. And I think that if we should take anything away from Leo and Piper is that love sometimes requires hard work and you should NEVER give up if things get tough.
|
|
ljones
Whitelighter
Posts: 4,123
|
Post by ljones on Oct 6, 2008 23:02:36 GMT -5
If there is one thing I admire about the show's writers is that they forced Piper and Leo to work at their relationship. No fairy tale nonsense for them.
|
|
|
|
Post by bbakely on Oct 12, 2008 13:25:43 GMT -5
 I don't think it was Phoebe's fault that cole became the Source. and i don't think it was Cole's fault either. It would have to be the Seer's fault for Cole's induction as the new source. What i remembered that Cole did not want the source's powers because he was trying to be good for Phoebe. It was the work of the seer that brought him to that side. At first Phoebe and Piper dismissed the fact the he was evil again and only Paige knew about him and she tryed to tell thim many times. When they did find out about Cole it was too late to stop it thus sending Phoebe down the evil side and that was Cole's fault for that.
|
|
Piper3
Whitelighter
Posts: 2,815
|
Post by Piper3 on Oct 23, 2008 18:00:21 GMT -5
I guess it was the seers fault but the thing that really bothers me is that fact that Phoebe had the chance for Cole to give up his powers but Phoebe said no. They never adressed the fact that Phoebe had that choice on the show, they just hated Cole for it.
|
|
charmedonep3527
Innocent
"Object(Logic) and reason go out the window when love gets involved." *Icon made by Piper Halliwell*
Posts: 25
|
Post by charmedonep3527 on Oct 24, 2008 18:58:00 GMT -5
I agree. Love is a difficult thing and sometimes people tend to think that marriage can solve the problems. I don't think that's true. Even through marriage, it's important to never give up no matter what.
|
|
Esmeralda
Charmed
S2 "What If...?"
Fan Fic Winner
Twenty Years Gone....But Never Forgotten.
Posts: 21,920
|
Post by Esmeralda on Oct 26, 2008 0:25:34 GMT -5
Which is why Piper and Leo living happily ever after at the end never made sense to me...Piper never seemed like the type to work on it or compromise, always forcing Leo to do things her way, and like at the beginning of S8, I would think that EVENTUALLY Leo would have had enough of that and walk away with his sons. For their sake, if nothing else, he wouldn't want to give the example of being Mommy's little errand boy all their lives.
Who knows? Maybe something like that FINALLY knocked some sense into Piper's ultra-hard head, and *that's* why they *were* able to work on it and compromise and have that happily ever after.
I know it was something similar that did that for my own parents and they were more in love the day Mom died than the day they got married.
|
|
