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Post by joshingabout on Feb 23, 2011 14:31:19 GMT -5
I have a theory about "The Ultimate Power", in regards to the Jenkins' VS The Charmed Ones.
The Triad believed that the Jenkins sisters were the key to the Ultimate Power. The Source, in Season 4, called the Hollow "The Ultimate Power". The Triad used Billie's connection to the Charmed Ones to gain "Charmed-like power" to summon the Hollow (implying that their own powers weren't enough to draw the Hollow from its crypt whereas the Charmed Ones could). Now, the only other being powerful enough to unleash the Hollow was The Source himself, and he definitely had power comparable to The Charmed Ones, being the Source of ALL EVIL.
Bille and Christy used Wyatt's Charmed-heritage power to summon the Hollow. The Charmed One's used their own powers to summon the Hollow, causing it to split between the two sets of sisters. The Ultimate Battle ensued, causing the Manor to explode due to the sheer power the battle unleashed, causing the Hollow itself to be expelled from the witches because of the sheer Overload.
Dumain tries to trick Billie into warning the Triad about the failed plan so they can get the Hollow again before the Charmed Ones do. The Ultimate Battle only ended once Christy was dead, as she was the only one still working on obtaining the power of the Hollow - no one else was, including Billie.
If Billie and Christy were really the Ultimate Power, would they need the Hollow? Couldn't Billie just phase them out of reality with her stupendous power? No. She doesn't have the power to erase the Charmed Ones from history. They needed the Hollow to have a CHANCE at taking out the Charmed Ones.
The Triad needed the Hollow - the "Ultimate Power" in the words of The Source. They were the key to getting the "Ultimate Power" through Billie's connection to Charmed power, as the Jenkins' did not have the power to do it themselves.
TL;DR
I believe that the Hollow is "The Ultimate Power" from Season 8. Billie and Christy were merely a conduit to access it. They were pawns, not players.
The Charmed Ones > The Jenkins.
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Esmeralda
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Post by Esmeralda on Feb 23, 2011 16:36:11 GMT -5
I have a theory about "The Ultimate Power", in regards to the Jenkins' VS The Charmed Ones. The Triad believed that the Jenkins sisters were the key to the Ultimate Power. The Source, in Season 4, called the Hollow "The Ultimate Power". The Triad used Billie's connection to the Charmed Ones to gain "Charmed-like power" to summon the Hollow (implying that their own powers weren't enough to draw the Hollow from its crypt whereas the Charmed Ones could). Now, the only other being powerful enough to unleash the Hollow was The Source himself, and he definitely had power comparable to The Charmed Ones, being the Source of ALL EVIL. Bille and Christy used Wyatt's Charmed-heritage power to summon the Hollow. The Charmed One's used their own powers to summon the Hollow, causing it to split between the two sets of sisters. The Ultimate Battle ensued, causing the Manor to explode due to the sheer power the battle unleashed, causing the Hollow itself to be expelled from the witches because of the sheer Overload. Dumain tries to trick Billie into warning the Triad about the failed plan so they can get the Hollow again before the Charmed Ones do. The Ultimate Battle only ended once Christy was dead, as she was the only one still working on obtaining the power of the Hollow - no one else was, including Billie. If Billie and Christy were really the Ultimate Power, would they need the Hollow? Couldn't Billie just phase them out of reality with her stupendous power? No. She doesn't have the power to erase the Charmed Ones from history. They needed the Hollow to have a CHANCE at taking out the Charmed Ones. The Triad needed the Hollow - the "Ultimate Power" in the words of The Source. They were the key to getting the "Ultimate Power" through Billie's connection to Charmed power, as the Jenkins' did not have the power to do it themselves. TL;DR I believe that the Hollow is "The Ultimate Power" from Season 8. Billie and Christy were merely a conduit to access it. They were pawns, not players. The Charmed Ones > The Jenkins. *nods* This makes a lot of sense, joshingabout. Looking at it this way, the Ultimate Power is the Charmed Ones with the Hollow just below it. I still don't think the Hollow (a single item) couldn be separated, but if you accept that, then everything you said works. Great job! For that, you have been blessed! |
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Post by joshingabout on Feb 23, 2011 18:14:05 GMT -5
I feel so special right now  This feels like a high honour Thank you, Esmeralda! I always wondered why people thought that the Jenkins' were so powerful. The only amazing thing that they did was vanquish the unvanquishable Noxon demon. To be perfectly honest, I think the Charmed Ones would have found a way anyway. Christy wasn't that powerful at all. She was a telepath and a firestarter. She could have been really dangerous, accessing others' powers through their minds, like Zack in Magic School, but that was never explored. She might not have had great control of her telepathy. Billie's power of Projection wasn't THAT powerful. Yes, she could bend a few things in reality, like the plant and her parent's lives, and travel through time, but then again, Tempus created Time-Loops and was the only known bearer of the power of Chronokinesis, the ability to manipulate time itself. Billie isn't that powerful. Coop could travel through time (albeit with the Cupid ring), and he isn't overpowered. Billie's power had to be amplified by the Staff of Buddha JUST to change the Charmed One's morality (from bad to good) - alone her power definitely was NOT strong enough to be ridiculous, like erase them from the present or what have you. I think I'd place the Charmed Ones and The Hollow as equals. The Hollow could absorb the Charmed One's powers (although it didn't steal their magic, as Piper and Paige could still cast the spell to vanquish The Source) but Charmed power could banish it back to it's crypt. I don't mind the idea of The Hollow being split among the two sets of sisters. The Woogeyman could possess multiple people and keep its own form and was still considered it's own entity. The Hollow is a being that consumes ALL magic. It's logical to think it would WANT to be part of the Jenkins' and the Charmed Ones' at the same time to consume everything. EDIT: Who would win? The Hollow VS The Nothing?!  |
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Post by erikamarie on Feb 24, 2011 11:09:01 GMT -5
I agree with you
In another board - Destined- some members were saying things like these, that Billie and Christy had more offensive power of Phoebe and even Paige but they weren't powerful as the Charmed One
Billie was the key because she was able to do what generation of demons had only dreamed of, to gain easy access to the Book of Shadows to the knowledge and the spells of Warren dinasty
Billie was the key because she got the most powerful weapon, the confidence of the sisters and Wyatt
A wonderful plan the sisters spent time teaching Billie the way to destroy them and if this were not enough, here is the ultimate weapon ready, Wyatt willing to help auntie Billie to evoke the Hollow!
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Post by ljones on Feb 25, 2011 4:02:41 GMT -5
I don't buy that. I just cannot see the Charmed Ones as "the Ultimate Power". They were supposed to be the most powerful witches. That did not make them the post powerful magical beings ever. Before or after Wyatt's birth. With or without the Hollow. I'm not even sure about Wyatt, who was surprisingly affected by Chris' telekinesis in "Chris-Crossed".
Remember . . . magical or not, the Halliwells are mortals. Which should make them less powerful than non-mortals.
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Esmeralda
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Post by Esmeralda on Feb 25, 2011 13:45:08 GMT -5
I don't buy that. I just cannot see the Charmed Ones as "the Ultimate Power". They were supposed to be the most powerful witches. That did not make them the post powerful magical beings ever. Before or after Wyatt's birth. With or without the Hollow. I'm not even sure about Wyatt, who was surprisingly affected by Chris' telekinesis in "Chris-Crossed". Remember . . . magical or not, the Halliwells are mortals. Which should make them less powerful than non-mortals. I'd agree except that as pointed out, the Charmed Ones could put the Hollow - something both the demons and the Elders were afraid of - back in its box - no need for both a creature of evil and a creature of good. So that makes them more powerful. Which, of course, is a bunch of BS. But then so is Forever Crap aka Forever Piper aka the Charmed finale, Kill Billie Vol. 2/Forever Charmed. Part of why I don't believe the ending of Kill Bille Vol2 and Forever Charmed actually happened but is Piper's delusion as she dies after the explosion in Kill Billie, Vol 2. But thinking about it, if you want to look at it the way joshingabout did (and I agree with most of what he said), I'll edit what I said earlier - it's not the Charmed Ones who are more powerful than the Hollow - it's the Power of Three, which according to the mythology of the show, is supposed to be the most powerful connection ever. And that I agree. Chris didn't have to turn the sisters into goddesses - they should've simply used the Power of Three (The Power of Three shall set us free) and that should've taken care of first the Titans and then the Jenkinses, even the Jenkinses infected by the Hollow. |
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Post by erikamarie on Feb 26, 2011 2:03:29 GMT -5
Maybe we'ld think of the Elders as keepers of powers they can't use but I also hated that line the Power of Three maybe with the help of Warren line as it was for the Source it'ld be a good base to fight the Titans
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Post by ghostrider on Feb 26, 2011 2:40:42 GMT -5
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Post by ljones on Feb 26, 2011 12:34:36 GMT -5
Is this some idiotic error on the writers' part that popped up in Season 8? Because I do recall Phoebe and the Seer being the ones to return the Hollow, back in Season 4. I also recall the old Source displaying no fear in using the Hollow for his own gain during that season. In fact, this whole thing about the Elders and demons being afraid of the Hollow and the only the sisters achieving this task, strikes me as another example of the writers trying to make the Halliwells "all powerful", instead of simply powerful witches. No wonder that my opinion of the show sank to new levels during its last three or four seasons. And if the sisters were that powerful, how is it that they were only able to fight the Triad to a draw before using the Hollow to kill them; yet Cole was able to kill them rather easily back in early S3?  |
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Post by Lexi on Feb 26, 2011 13:28:44 GMT -5
Is this some idiotic error on the writers' part that popped up in Season 8? Because I do recall Phoebe and the Seer being the ones to return the Hollow, back in Season 4. I also recall the old Source displaying no fear in using the Hollow for his own gain during that season. In fact, this whole thing about the Elders and demons being afraid of the Hollow and the only the sisters achieving this task, strikes me as another example of the writers trying to make the Halliwells "all powerful", instead of simply powerful witches. No wonder that my opinion of the show sank to new levels during its last three or four seasons. And if the sisters were that powerful, how is it that they were only able to fight the Triad to a draw before using the Hollow to kill them; yet Cole was able to kill them rather easily back in early S3? I'll agree with you here, LJones. It was just an attempt to show how super powerful the Charmed Ones were; and it wasn't even the Charmed Ones, it was Penny, Patty and Piper! There is no way that should have been possible. Season 8 was just a show that the writers were bored and just wanted the series to set up their spin off, which thank God they did not get! |
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Post by Esmeralda on Feb 26, 2011 15:12:49 GMT -5
Is this some idiotic error on the writers' part that popped up in Season 8? Because I do recall Phoebe and the Seer being the ones to return the Hollow, back in Season 4. I also recall the old Source displaying no fear in using the Hollow for his own gain during that season. In fact, this whole thing about the Elders and demons being afraid of the Hollow and the only the sisters achieving this task, strikes me as another example of the writers trying to make the Halliwells "all powerful", instead of simply powerful witches. No wonder that my opinion of the show sank to new levels during its last three or four seasons. And if the sisters were that powerful, how is it that they were only able to fight the Triad to a draw before using the Hollow to kill them; yet Cole was able to kill them rather easily back in early S3? I'll agree with you here, LJones. It was just an attempt to show how super powerful the Charmed Ones were; and it wasn't even the Charmed Ones, it was Penny, Patty and Piper! There is no way that should have been possible. Season 8 was just a show that the writers were bored and just wanted the series to set up their spin off, which thank God they did not get! AMEN! I wonder if the members of the Triad were the only previous Big Bads that Kern could talk into coming back. Like Ljones said, how could they be so powerful when Cole was able to get rid of them, and didn't even have to be Belthazor to do it?? |
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Post by erikamarie on Mar 2, 2011 11:38:29 GMT -5
In the most part of the ancient legends and mythes it is believed that strong powers'ld infect the wisdom of a leader We talked of this in Destined:maybe the Elders can give powers but cannot use them and this held true till It's a bad bad bad world when Leo flipped out and used a forbidden power . He infected the Elders and they lost their wisdom Could it work? I hated the Elders in 7 and 8 season |
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Post by Esmeralda on Mar 2, 2011 15:04:08 GMT -5
Makes sense, but to me it makes more sense that like Leo, the S6-8 Elders are the Elders who were risen to Elder long before their time due to the massacre of the Elders by the Titans, all thanks to Chris, so like Leo, their powers went to their head.
*shakes head* But I love your idea of everything screwed up thanks to Leo turning into a murderer all for a man who wasn't even truly his son, but was the son of a totally different Leo.
Although the ones whose powers truly went to their head were the Charmed Ones. Chris should've never had Leo turn them into goddesses.
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Post by ghostrider on Mar 7, 2011 16:42:20 GMT -5
Posted by erikamarie on 3/2/11 at 11:38am
Oh, okay...I really do need to dust off seasons 5, 6, and 7...I don't own 8...and check some of this out. I confess that I am not a Charmed expert, just an early fan wanting Prue to return.
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Post by ljones on Mar 7, 2011 18:33:55 GMT -5
Their powers started going to their heads as far back as Season 2.
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Post by pppiper on Mar 9, 2011 14:31:10 GMT -5
Where too in Season 2?
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Post by ljones on Mar 10, 2011 12:36:42 GMT -5
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Post by Lexi on Mar 10, 2011 13:45:17 GMT -5
Awakened was a mistake in which they learnt from. Prue and Phoebe panicked and used personal gain and it was a mistake - they were human and all humans make mistake. They were also never raised to really think about personal gain, which was Grams' fault.
But when they found out the mistakes they made, they reversed the spell even though it meant possibly losing their sister, so that they could save innocents.
Now, Leo, yes he misused his powers but he took the consequences for his actions. It's only like doctors doing everything they can to save the loves of their life - something that was touched on in Greys Anatomy for those that watch that.
Did power really go to their heads when they knew that what they were doing was wrong? and either they reversed what they did or took the consequences with no arguments.
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Post by ghostrider on Mar 10, 2011 14:25:43 GMT -5
This episode has been a big bone of contention around The Cafe. Perhaps someone would like to take it to court on the "Law and Witch-Order" thread... |
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Post by pppiper on Mar 10, 2011 16:47:50 GMT -5
Awe right, cause they saved Piper? Would've been hard to keep replacing the sisters mind if they had them all die willy-nilly ;D |
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This feels like a high honour 
