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Post by jdpm1991 on Jan 31, 2016 17:57:32 GMT -5
In the first few episodes of Season 4, Phoebe grew closer to Paige than Piper did. Were they trying to build a Prue/Piper relationship with Phoebe and Paige?
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Post by Melinda Halliwell on Jan 31, 2016 20:57:21 GMT -5
No I don't think they weren't even though it might've appeared that way to some people obviously.
It took Piper longer to accept Paige remember because she'd just lost her older sister and like Piper said episode 1 then she wasn't looking for anyone to replace Prue whereas Phoebe wasn't affected by that as much as Piper was and actually wanted to get to know Paige really hence why they may've appeared closer with one another.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 1, 2016 11:04:22 GMT -5
I wouldn't say they were meant to be Prue and Piper. If anything they were meant to mirror how Piper and Phoebe used to be. I believe that's what they were going for; attempting a similar dynamic while introducing Paige.
If you compare how the original sisters started with how P3 2.0 started-
-The eldest sister is very harsh and not incredibly accepting of the youngest; she's frustrated by her free-spiritedness.
-The middle sister is more open to the youngest, while attempting to temper the eldest sister's judgement.
-The youngest sister sometimes butts heads with the eldest, but they gradually listen to each other more and develop a decent amount of respect. The youngest will often follow her gut and have to convince her elder sisters to trust her that it's worth taking the risk. At times she get's overexcited discovering her magic and that can sometimes get her into trouble.
This applies to early season 1 and early season 4. They were trying to make the eldest/middle/youngest roles what they used to be. So Phoebe took Piper's old role and Paige took Phoebe's.
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Esmeralda
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Post by Esmeralda on Feb 1, 2016 19:43:57 GMT -5
I wouldn't say they were meant to be Prue and Piper. If anything they were meant to mirror how Piper and Phoebe used to be. I believe that's what they were going for; attempting a similar dynamic while introducing Paige. If you compare how the original sisters started with how P3 2.0 started- -The eldest sister is very harsh and not incredibly accepting of the youngest; she's frustrated by her free-spiritedness.
-The middle sister is more open to the youngest, while attempting to temper the eldest sister's judgement.
-The youngest sister sometimes butts heads with the eldest, but they gradually listen to each other more and develop a decent amount of respect. The youngest will often follow her gut and have to convince her elder sisters to trust her that it's worth taking the risk. At times she get's overexcited discovering her magic and that can sometimes get her into trouble.
This applies to early season 1 and early season 4. They were trying to make the eldest/middle/youngest roles what they used to be. So Phoebe took Piper's old role and Paige took Phoebe's. I agree totally and it's also partially why the second set started to seem like roommates rather than sisters. Piper was *never* the Oldest (even dead, Prue always was); Phoebe was *never* the Middle (Piper always was) and Paige, who although the youngest, was raised as an Only Child and was *never* the Baby (Phoebe always was). The writers forced them into those roles during the first part of Season 4, but then they all slipped back to their regular roles and without Prue's leadership, Piper and Phoebe took on the worst characteristics of a Middle and a Baby as compared to the better parts as they did in the earlier seasons. That - trying to make the show "fresh" by messing with the Birth Order for women who were no longer children - was one of Brad Kern's worst mistakes. Me, I'll always wish that as an Only Child (which is much more like an Oldest than it is like a Baby) that once she learned how to be a witch (S4/S5) that Paige had taken over the leadership, especially if Paige was allowed to remain a social worker and use her skills to help her sisters get over their problems (Piper with losing Prue and Phoebe with losing Cole) and be able to let Piper go back to being the caring Heart of her own family and Phoebs go back to being the loveable Baby rather than Poor, Poor Pitiful Piper and PhoeME. They would both mature from their experiences, thanks to Paige's help (something neither ever did) but Piper would go back to caring for others and not just herself and Phoebe would be able to go back to enjoying magic rather than just losing herself in sexual relationships. |
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Post by erikamarie on Feb 3, 2016 1:33:55 GMT -5
In the first few episodes of Season 4, Phoebe grew closer to Paige than Piper did. Were they trying to build a Prue/Piper relationship with Phoebe and Paige? The relationships between sisters develop over time Prue has Penny's strong temper and being the eldest exacerbates this characteristic because Penny gives her custody of her baby sisters Piper has Patty's sweet temper and being the middle sister exacerbates her patient ability to mediate between two very similar sisters Phoebe looks like Prue but her being the youngest, without liability to the other sisters, increased a tendency to rebellion which belongs also to Prue, see Just Harried Paige looks like Phoebe and Prue, has the independence of who grew up as an only child, the discipline of those who fought alcoholism and as Phoebe has the insecurities of those who lost parents soon Their is an equal relationship, often they bicker, interfere in the love affairs of the other and protect each other |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 4, 2016 3:53:14 GMT -5
I agree totally and it's also partially why the second set started to seem like roommates rather than sisters. Piper was *never* the Oldest (even dead, Prue always was); Phoebe was *never* the Middle (Piper always was) and Paige, who although the youngest, was raised as an Only Child and was *never* the Baby (Phoebe always was). The writers forced them into those roles during the first part of Season 4, but then they all slipped back to their regular roles and without Prue's leadership, Piper and Phoebe took on the worst characteristics of a Middle and a Baby as compared to the better parts as they did in the earlier seasons. That - trying to make the show "fresh" by messing with the Birth Order for women who were no longer children - was one of Brad Kern's worst mistakes. Me, I'll always wish that as an Only Child (which is much more like an Oldest than it is like a Baby) that once she learned how to be a witch (S4/S5) that Paige had taken over the leadership, especially if Paige was allowed to remain a social worker and use her skills to help her sisters get over their problems (Piper with losing Prue and Phoebe with losing Cole) and be able to let Piper go back to being the caring Heart of her own family and Phoebs go back to being the loveable Baby rather than Poor, Poor Pitiful Piper and PhoeME. They would both mature from their experiences, thanks to Paige's help (something neither ever did) but Piper would go back to caring for others and not just herself and Phoebe would be able to go back to enjoying magic rather than just losing herself in sexual relationships. Definitely. Something just feels out of step about those episodes in which Piper and Phoebe are attempting to tell Paige what to do. Of course they had to teach her the Craft and take her under their wing initially, but Paige, the Only Child Paige, would not have taken orders from a nagging Piper or a patronising Phoebe. She met them as a 25-year-old woman, she'd have been more likely to tell them to go screw themselves! I also thought the writers were taking Paige down the Leader route in Season 5. It's a pity it didn't stay that way in Season 6, where she started to became more 'ugh, magic...' Even if they wanted her to take a step back from being Super Witch in S5, why the hell did they not have her return to being a social worker, instead of those ridiculous temp jobs? |
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Post by sol on Feb 4, 2016 7:09:21 GMT -5
I disagree totally
An only child'ld never be able to manage a group, it's something you learn, and I say this as an only child
When I did the interview for the the big advertising and marketing agency I work for, the manager told me I was among the candidates, I had good grades, good manners, I was breezyt and pretty
My only flaw was that I was an only child and only children are struggling to work in teams
They took on me anyway and I realized that they were right, I'm used to choose for me, never to lead, never to mediate
Often I fear to overwhelm the others and I kept aside, often I realize too late that I had to mediate: it is difficult
Who grows with siblings learn from an early age and in this I agree with Erika: Prue, who inherited Grams' strong personality, learned as a child to be a leader, Piper, who inherited her mom's quiet personality, instead learned to mediate and conciliate
I am sure that some of the writers were only children and I gather it from some Paige uncertainties when she acts with the sisters:she hesitates or waits, as she afraid of make mistakes
As in Forever Charmed famous final scene, when Piper tells Paige to call for the ring: Paige is just stunned not because she's stupid but because she has not the sync of those who grew up together
The same in Hyde School Reunion:Paige doesn't orb the gun as soon as she sees it because she tries to figure out what Phoebe is thinking, if Phoebe has an her own plan
In Centennial Charmed it's even more obvious; Paige takes the initiative to attack Cole while the sisters are practicing for Piper's delivery
This because she feels the need to act alone, she can't understand Piper and Phoebe's reluctance to eliminate Cole, she wants to resolve the situation
Paige: I just feel like, you know, having been an only child for twenty-five years, I'm used to doing everything on my own. And it seems like lately I've had to do everything by committee and it just...
Phoebe: You feel like you've lost yourself along the way?
Paige: Yeah.
And I understand this feeling, it's so hard to work in team!
No, Paige wasn't fit for being the Charmed Ones's leader, only Prue was, Piper knew this and did her best
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Esmeralda
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Post by Esmeralda on Feb 4, 2016 7:36:00 GMT -5
I disagree totally An only child'ld never be able to manage a group, it's something you learn, and I say this as an only child When I did the interview for the the big advertising and marketing agency I work for, the manager told me I was among the candidates, I had good grades, good manners, I was breezyt and pretty My only flaw was that I was an only child and only children are struggling to work in teams They took on me anyway and I realized that they were right, I'm used to choose for me, never to lead, never to mediate Often I fear to overwhelm the others and I kept aside, often I realize too late that I had to mediate: it is difficult Who grows with siblings learn from an early age and in this I agree with Erika: Prue, who inherited Grams' strong personality, learned as a child to be a leader, Piper, who inherited her mom's quiet personality, instead learned to mediate and conciliate I am sure that some of the writers were only children and I gather it from some Paige uncertainties when she acts with the sisters:she hesitates or waits, as she afraid of make mistakes As in Forever Charmed famous final scene, when Piper tells Paige to call for the ring: Paige is just stunned not because she's stupid but because she has not the sync of those who grew up together The same in Hyde School Reunion:Paige doesn't orb the gun as soon as she sees it because she tries to figure out what Phoebe is thinking, if Phoebe has an her own plan In Centennial Charmed it's even more obvious; Paige takes the initiative to attack Cole while the sisters are practicing for Piper's delivery This because she feels the need to act alone, she can't understand Piper and Phoebe's reluctance to eliminate Cole, she wants to resolve the situation Paige: I just feel like, you know, having been an only child for twenty-five years, I'm used to doing everything on my own. And it seems like lately I've had to do everything by committee and it just... Phoebe: You feel like you've lost yourself along the way? Paige: Yeah. And I understand this feeling, it's so hard to work in team! No, Paige wasn't fit for being the Charmed Ones's leader, only Prue was, Piper knew this and did her best Oh, I agree that Only Children don't make good team members for the exact reason you mentioned. But that's not why Paige wasn't a good one - that's because the writers tried to write her as a Baby, not as an Only Child. But telling the others what to do and helping them, yes, that should've been her proper role, especially with how crappy Piper was as leader and how as a Middle, she would've given up that leadership role without blinking her eye since she'd know her best was nowhere near good enough. And I'm an Oldest but have have known a lot of Only Children - two of my best friends are Onlys - and what I wrote earlier was based on them. |
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Post by erikamarie on Feb 8, 2016 15:37:29 GMT -5
Something Wicca This Way Goes
PIPER: Okay. Any ideas?
PHOEBE: Oh, I was hoping you'd have some.
PIPER: Me? Why me?
PHOEBE: Well, because you're the only one who still has any confidence around here.
PIPER: Yeah, well, that's just 'cause I'm a good actor.
PAIGE: Well, I hope you can fool the Book because unless we get our confidence back -- and fast -- it may not let us get it back. And if Zankou gets The Nexus first, there won't even be a point of trying.
It is one of my favorite dialogues,eye-opening about the dynamics between the three sisters: ironic and affectionate but also full of confidence in their older sister's experience
Piper'ld never have Prue's role, nevertheless she came up with her own way of being a leader, with doubts about herself but more sure after her pregnancy
Paige has never been treated as the baby of the family,only as a sister who has to learn how being a witch, but regrding personal relationships, she and Phoebe seem roommates
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