Wyatt turning evil - Imaginary Friends

[gzv969]

So after watching this episode once again I’m beginning to wonder if chris got it all wrong and this episode was the event that eventually turned wyatt evil. Maybe it wasn’t Gideon after all. Gideon trying to kill wyatt was a betrayal but without future chris there, I’m sure Leo would have still killed Gideon and though wyatt was traumatized he would have still recovered and forgotten the incident eventually with leo and pipers loving support. The worst that would have happened would have been either Gideon or Barbas killing him or chasing him a bit longer until Leo or the charmed ones killed them

But in this case if not for the fact that future wyatt was summoned, 2 year old wyatt could have been corrupted without them knowing and slowly over the years wyatt would have grown more and more evil before their eyes. And we see how piper handled future evil wyatt here. If she did this with him most of his growing childhood while he grew older and more evil, could have resulted in a more evil defiant wyatt.

Similarities with other episodes
1. Paige and piper were on edge every-time the phone rang because a demon was always attacking when it did. Similar to season 4 “A knight to Remember” when the shocker demon attacked piper and phoebe every time the electricity was used or something powered on or plugged into the socket.

2. Phoebe and Paige ambushed by the crowd of demons evil wyatt through at them. Same as in season 5 “the day that magic died” when phoebe and Paige also were ambushed by the demons in the restaurant

One thing I noticed in the beginning of this episode Paige is the only one that notices demons attack everytime the phone rings and is working on a plan by herself to fix it. Piper and Phoebe have no idea that's happening. Another case of Paige being the only one doing all the demon fighting around the house. Piper is so engrossed with Wyatt and preschool while phoebe is in school oblivious to whats going on at home

Loved Paige and pipers interaction in this episode. They were both so funny. They both bickered at each other constantly and Paige refused to give into pipers controlling nature no matter how hard piper tried. Loved especially the moment piper was shouting in Paige’s ear when Paige suggested that Wyatt might be creating the demons attacking since it was only happening when the preschool called the manor.

[Sadrick]

Gideon's attempts to kill Wyatt always appeared like a poorly constructed device to try and rationalise his switching sides. Demons and other assorted monsters are always going after the Halliwells. Why would this time be any different? Gideon's betrayal shouldn't matter to him since he was infant at the time who had no conscious awareness of what was going on really. I doubt he would have recalled what this one wayward elder did over two decades ago as an adult. It makes sense for Wyatt to have been warped through the events of "Imaginary Friends".

Also, regarding Leo killing Gideon, I'm not so sure about that. Leo would have had plenty of rage inspired adrenaline to make himself pose a danger to Gideon's life, but the man was stated to be one of the most powerful elders in existence. The reason Leo was able to kill him in the first place is because he successfully executed a cloak & dagger manoeuvre to weaken him first. Without that, Gideon might very well have been able to defend himself, if not kill Leo in an ironic twist of fate. But then you would have a wrathful Power of Three out for blood once they hear that their beloved whitelighter/family member has been killed. Gideon's days would be numbered no matter how you slice it.

[gzv969]

May 3, 2018 8:41:51 GMT -5 Sadrick said:

Gideon's attempts to kill Wyatt always appeared like a poorly constructed device to try and rationalise his switching sides. Demons and other assorted monsters are always going after the Halliwells. Why would this time be any different? Gideon's betrayal shouldn't matter to him since he was infant at the time who had no conscious awareness of what was going on really. I doubt he would have recalled what this one wayward elder did over two decades ago as an adult. It makes sense for Wyatt to have been warped through the events of "Imaginary Friends".

Also, regarding Leo killing Gideon, I'm not so sure about that. Leo would have had plenty of rage inspired adrenaline to make himself pose a danger to Gideon's life, but the man was stated to be one of the most powerful elders in existence. The reason Leo was able to kill him in the first place is because he successfully executed a cloak & dagger manoeuvre to weaken him first. Without that, Gideon might very well have been able to defend himself, if not kill Leo in an ironic twist of fate. But then you would have a wrathful Power of Three out for blood once they hear that their beloved whitelighter/family member has been killed. Gideon's days would be numbered no matter how you slice it.

Also when future Wyatt saw the demon talking to little Wyatt, he said, “don’t I know you?”. Meaning he began to remember having talked to him in his past. Also when future Wyatt fought the demons in the attic he suddenly had a demonic voice for a brief moment just before incinerating the demons with his powers. Which could indicate he was already on the path to evil in the future at 25. Leo even said if they didn’t know what just happened to little Wyatt, he would have become the evil wyatt they were seeing now in the next 25 years.

And future evil wyatt tried to take Little wyatt back with him to the future so that piper wouldn’t try to corrupt him back to good. What if in Chris’s previous timeline, this had happened as we saw, and evil future Wyatt succeeded in returning to his future, but without little Wyatt. Future chris then is confronted with a totally evil Wyatt and is confused how he suddenly became evil. Chris then cast a spell to return to the past to find out what happened but it brings him further back in time.

But what chris probably didn’t realize is his mission was more to bring Leo and piper back together so Leo didn’t go off and leave, becoming a full time elder. If Leo had stayed a full time elder, He wouldn’t have been present in this episode as a father, and wouldn’t have been there to talk evil wyatt out of being evil (the father son talk). It would have been left to just Piper and her sisters, and piper would have kept using brute force and magic on evil wyatt which would have not helped.

[Esmeralda]

You're missing an important step - if Chris had never talked Leo into becoming an Elder in order to turn the sisters into goddesses, Leo would have always been there for Wyatt...

[gzv969]

Good point

[Melinda Halliwell]

Exactly what Chris did coming back to the past and getting his dad to become an Elder earlier than he did in his future made his parents split up and Piper want to divorce Leo instead of just saying hi I'm your son Chris and I need your help trying to stop my brother Wyatt from becoming evil in the future which Piper and Leo would've accepted after explaining and tried all they can to help him keeping Leo on earth and there for Wyatt.

[Esmeralda]

Nope, I don't think that Leo was ever an Elder in Chris' original future when the Titans were in charge, not Wyatt - there would've been no reason for Leo to think otherwise if all of the Elders were killed as would've happened had Chris not come back.

I think Chris got his father to do that so he could become the Charmed Ones' whitelighter and he could get rid of Wyatt. That, of course, changed the SECOND time he came back - the time we see. Along that line, I don't think he met Bianca the first time around when the Titans were in charge.

In case you're wondering, yes, I *do* think that the first time around, Paige was killed so no Power of Three to get rid of the Titans. But this wasn't the case the second time around, when Paige was able to give him money and the Charmed Ones vanquished over a thousand demons before they themselves were vanquished.

This explanation - that this is the second time Chris went to the past because he changed things for the worst the first time - is the only thing that makes all the inconsistencies between Chris in Season Five (before Brian Krause signed his second contract so Chris blowing up his atoms wasn't the last time we'd see Leo), Chris in Season Six (Leo an Elder for the first time) and Wyatt in Season Seven (when he could still turn evil and it's Leo who saves him, not Chris) make sense.

Of course this is totally different than what happens in fanfics, but since they are all alternate universes of Canon Charmed...

[mute90]

I don't think so for a few reasons:

One is that the Wyatt who first returns is good. He remembers living a good future. The teddy bear corrupts gradually. If that Wyatt was still under the influence and still that good, it would take years more to corrupt him. The abrupt change was because the future was in jeopardy and Wyatt was closely linked to his past self by the spell Piper used. The future was in jeopardy because Vicus saw Future!Wyatt and pushed his plan faster. Basically, things happened as they did with Vicus because a time traveler's influence interfered. Vicus was actively trying to change the future. If Future!Wyatt wasn't there, Vicus would have moved slower and the sisters and Leo would have figured it out.

Another thing is that Chris knew when evil got to Wyatt. He says something happened before he was born. That's why he showed up when he did.

Trauma in early childhood also doesn't have to be remembered to have an effect. Stuff like separation and threatening changes to the environment can cause problems in the development of social skills and disrupt the bond with their parents. Maybe Piper and Leo could handle it together, but we don't know they were together. Leo is described as not a factor in the future and Chris didn't like bothering Piper because she had so much to deal with. I get the impression it wasn't a stable, supportive family in the future.

[magena]

Jun 5, 2018 13:58:07 GMT -5 mute90 said:

I don't think so for a few reasons:

One is that the Wyatt who first returns is good. He remembers living a good future. The teddy bear corrupts gradually. If that Wyatt was still under the influence and still that good, it would take years more to corrupt him. The abrupt change was because the future was in jeopardy and Wyatt was closely linked to his past self by the spell Piper used. The future was in jeopardy because Vicus saw Future!Wyatt and pushed his plan faster. Basically, things happened as they did with Vicus because a time traveler's influence interfered. Vicus was actively trying to change the future. If Future!Wyatt wasn't there, Vicus would have moved slower and the sisters and Leo would have figured it out.

Another thing is that Chris knew when evil got to Wyatt. He says something happened before he was born. That's why he showed up when he did.

Trauma in early childhood also doesn't have to be remembered to have an effect. Stuff like separation and threatening changes to the environment can cause problems in the development of social skills and disrupt the bond with their parents. Maybe Piper and Leo could handle it together, but we don't know they were together. Leo is described as not a factor in the future and Chris didn't like bothering Piper because she had so much to deal with. I get the impression it wasn't a stable, supportive family in the future.

I agree

[Kira Halliwell]

I don't find any inconsistencies with this episode and the story line with Chris. I believe that Chris was correct in his calculation of when the Wyatt from his future turned evil, due to Gideon. What I think happened is that once Chris and the sisters "fixed" the timeline and Wyatt was turned good in the future, it laid the foundation for this episode to happen.

Without the kidnapping of Wyatt by Gideon (or whatever it was that Gideon did to create "Evil Wyatt"), it was known throughout the magical community that Wyatt was still good. Vicus then sets up his idea to turn Wyatt evil - he isn't the first, and surely wouldn't be the last person who at least THOUGHT of that idea - through his teddy bear. When "Good Wyatt" comes back from the future due to Piper's spell, he is already affected by little Wyatt's seeing Vicus and having him as an imaginary friend. BUT, since Vicus hadn't completed his mission yet (he had not gotten his hands on the teddy bear), Wyatt was not yet evil. When Wyatt asks Vicus if he knows him or has seen him (I can't remember the exact quote at this time), he is merely remembering the fact that Vicus was his imaginary friend, not the fact that Vicus turned him evil. 

Once Vicus got his hands on the bear and turned Wyatt evil, obviously Future Wyatt turned evil as well, thus creating a whole new future timeline. 

I hope I made sense...sometimes it's hard for me to express my thoughts coherently!