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Post by astralp on Feb 24, 2019 0:00:11 GMT -5
I was re-watching Murphy's Luck and even though it was a demon of the week episode, it seems like an underrated or easily-skipped over episode especially for the serious subject matter it deals with.
Sure, Maggie and Prue's suicidality was influenced by the darklighter, but the whole concept of a Spirit Killer would have been something interesting to be explored as a character depth plot tool (versus it just being a monster of the week that makes you fall into despair with enough bad luck).
We saw some character development when the darklighter used Prue's vulnerabilities (especially her guilt about Andy—I had forgotten he did that years after watching the episode), but the depressed feelings were quickly forgotten once he was vanquished.
(Sidenote: Also, the Elders are jerks to ban people from becoming whitelighters because of suicide. Magically influenced or not, people don't choose to be depressed. I know it's because according to Leo they "lose their souls"—but that's a really harmful and inaccurate message to send about how mental health works. Plus 1 for Phoebe when she told the darklighter lots of people recover from depression. This is the old compassionate pre-season 4 Phoebe I miss.)
It would have made sense for Prue to have been in some kind of therapy after that, because neither vanquishing Abraxas nor Darryl's message from Andy was enough to deal with the guilt she felt over Andy's death if the Spirit Killer was able to re-trigger that. In addition, she was also going through a career transition, she was still contending with the identity of being a maternal figure to her sisters and may even have probable resentment at Grams for not letting her go out east for school (even after finding out the real reason Grams wanted to keep them together).
Phoebe and Piper admitted she sacrificed her childhood, which can often happen with older children who lose one or both parents. They become parentified and depending on how developmentally appropriate their responsibilities are, don't even have the headspace to figure out who they are beyond their role. I don't think Grams was abusive toward Prue, but they did mention her being pretty hard on her.
I also wonder if some of her self-sacrificial behaviors (such as jumping in front of Shax's energy blast instead of trying to tk him or the boom, and jumping into the pit when infected with pride) was some sort of unconscious death wish disguised as bravery or tenacity. In season 3, her astral self literally splits her psyche in two because of the unhappiness she keeps pushing down in favor of the expectations and obligations her conscious self keeps pushing her to live up to.
I know it's a bit of a random brain dump, but as someone who studied social work it interests me.
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Post by prudencehalliwell on Feb 24, 2019 0:43:30 GMT -5
I was re-watching Murphy's Luck and even though it was a demon of the week episode, it seems like an underrated or easily-skipped over episode especially for the serious subject matter it deals with. Sure, Maggie and Prue's suicidality was influenced by the darklighter, but the whole concept of a Spirit Killer would have been something interesting to be explored as a character depth plot tool (versus it just being a monster of the week that makes you fall into despair with enough bad luck). We saw some character development when the darklighter used Prue's vulnerabilities (especially her guilt about Andy—I had forgotten he did that years after watching the episode), but the depressed feelings were quickly forgotten once he was vanquished. (Sidenote: Also, the Elders are jerks to ban people from becoming whitelighters because of suicide. Magically influenced or not, people don't choose to be depressed. I know it's because according to Leo they "lose their souls"—but that's a really harmful and inaccurate message to send about how mental health works. Plus 1 for Phoebe when she told the darklighter lots of people recover from depression. This is the old compassionate pre-season 4 Phoebe I miss.) It would have made sense for Prue to have been in some kind of therapy after that, because neither vanquishing Abraxas nor Darryl's message from Andy was enough to deal with the guilt she felt over Andy's death if the Spirit Killer was able to re-trigger that. In addition, she was also going through a career transition, she was still contending with the identity of being a maternal figure to her sisters and may even have probable resentment at Grams for not letting her go out east for school (even after finding out the real reason Grams wanted to keep them together). Phoebe and Piper admitted she sacrificed her childhood, which can often happen with older children who lose one or both parents. They become parentified and depending on how developmentally appropriate their responsibilities are, don't even have the headspace to figure out who they are beyond their role. I don't think Grams was abusive toward Prue, but they did mention her being pretty hard on her. I also wonder if some of her self-sacrificial behaviors (such as jumping in front of Shax's energy blast instead of trying to tk him or the boom, and jumping into the pit when infected with pride) was some sort of unconscious death wish disguised as bravery or tenacity. In season 3, her astral self literally splits her psyche in two because of the unhappiness she keeps pushing down in favor of the expectations and obligations her conscious self keeps pushing her to live up to. I know it's a bit of a random brain dump, but as someone who studied social work it interests me. First off, welcome to the Cafe! Not at all, I found this fascinating to read, astralp.  Your brought up some really good points. Prue had to grow up way too fast looking after her sisters, and the death of Patty really affected her. In our board re-watch, she couldn't say 'I Love you' to her sisters as it was the last thing she said to her mother. But so many stories of Prue was her coming to terms with her inner demons and personal issues. The death of Patty and even Andy really affected her so much. But I do agree, that this type of story could have been interesting to see explored for more episodes. I do like ones that deal more with them being sisters or the more human stories than the magical ones. It grounds the show more. |
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Post by Elle Em on Feb 26, 2019 11:29:22 GMT -5
These issues with Prue are things I wish the show had focused on more. Her brush with death with the darklighter and her astral self leaving her body in season 3 were both very serious indications that she was struggling psychologically. But nothing came of it. Prue said she was never actually suicidal, just a bit depressed, and she promised Phoebe she'd try to start living life more for herself in season 3, but she never actually did, either by choice or because she died.
These things with Prue, Phoebe needing to come to terms with her dark side after coming back from being evil, and Paige's past issues with her parents dying, her abandonment at birth, struggling to fit in with her sisters and her new life as a witch, and her past alcoholism were all things that the show could have explored more in depth. Instead they mostly focused on Piper and Leo's love life.
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Post by ryang on Feb 26, 2019 17:48:45 GMT -5
Golly - I know that the writers were no way creative or imaginative to think of those things, but, yeah, a number of scenes/episodes got at that issue from 1.20 to 3.16, where it could be way more than Prue's pride or bravery. These are great observations and connections.
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Post by zoeysmom on Jun 11, 2021 12:32:37 GMT -5
I was re-watching Murphy's Luck and even though it was a demon of the week episode, it seems like an underrated or easily-skipped over episode especially for the serious subject matter it deals with. Sure, Maggie and Prue's suicidality was influenced by the darklighter, but the whole concept of a Spirit Killer would have been something interesting to be explored as a character depth plot tool (versus it just being a monster of the week that makes you fall into despair with enough bad luck). We saw some character development when the darklighter used Prue's vulnerabilities (especially her guilt about Andy—I had forgotten he did that years after watching the episode), but the depressed feelings were quickly forgotten once he was vanquished. (Sidenote: Also, the Elders are jerks to ban people from becoming whitelighters because of suicide. Magically influenced or not, people don't choose to be depressed. I know it's because according to Leo they "lose their souls"—but that's a really harmful and inaccurate message to send about how mental health works. Plus 1 for Phoebe when she told the darklighter lots of people recover from depression. This is the old compassionate pre-season 4 Phoebe I miss.) It would have made sense for Prue to have been in some kind of therapy after that, because neither vanquishing Abraxas nor Darryl's message from Andy was enough to deal with the guilt she felt over Andy's death if the Spirit Killer was able to re-trigger that. In addition, she was also going through a career transition, she was still contending with the identity of being a maternal figure to her sisters and may even have probable resentment at Grams for not letting her go out east for school (even after finding out the real reason Grams wanted to keep them together). Phoebe and Piper admitted she sacrificed her childhood, which can often happen with older children who lose one or both parents. They become parentified and depending on how developmentally appropriate their responsibilities are, don't even have the headspace to figure out who they are beyond their role. I don't think Grams was abusive toward Prue, but they did mention her being pretty hard on her. I also wonder if some of her self-sacrificial behaviors (such as jumping in front of Shax's energy blast instead of trying to tk him or the boom, and jumping into the pit when infected with pride) was some sort of unconscious death wish disguised as bravery or tenacity. In season 3, her astral self literally splits her psyche in two because of the unhappiness she keeps pushing down in favor of the expectations and obligations her conscious self keeps pushing her to live up to. I know it's a bit of a random brain dump, but as someone who studied social work it interests me. Good points! I would've liked to see the show deal with the sisters' mental health more. Prue getting therapy after that episode would be nice. And I agree, I miss the compassion Phoebe showed in earlier seasons. |
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rebooted
Witch
Started watching at 12
Posts: 1,803 
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Post by rebooted on Jun 16, 2021 2:30:16 GMT -5
I was re-watching Murphy's Luck and even though it was a demon of the week episode, it seems like an underrated or easily-skipped over episode especially for the serious subject matter it deals with. Sure, Maggie and Prue's suicidality was influenced by the darklighter, but the whole concept of a Spirit Killer would have been something interesting to be explored as a character depth plot tool (versus it just being a monster of the week that makes you fall into despair with enough bad luck). We saw some character development when the darklighter used Prue's vulnerabilities (especially her guilt about Andy—I had forgotten he did that years after watching the episode), but the depressed feelings were quickly forgotten once he was vanquished. (Sidenote: Also, the Elders are jerks to ban people from becoming whitelighters because of suicide. Magically influenced or not, people don't choose to be depressed. I know it's because according to Leo they "lose their souls"—but that's a really harmful and inaccurate message to send about how mental health works. Plus 1 for Phoebe when she told the darklighter lots of people recover from depression. This is the old compassionate pre-season 4 Phoebe I miss.) It would have made sense for Prue to have been in some kind of therapy after that, because neither vanquishing Abraxas nor Darryl's message from Andy was enough to deal with the guilt she felt over Andy's death if the Spirit Killer was able to re-trigger that. In addition, she was also going through a career transition, she was still contending with the identity of being a maternal figure to her sisters and may even have probable resentment at Grams for not letting her go out east for school (even after finding out the real reason Grams wanted to keep them together). Phoebe and Piper admitted she sacrificed her childhood, which can often happen with older children who lose one or both parents. They become parentified and depending on how developmentally appropriate their responsibilities are, don't even have the headspace to figure out who they are beyond their role. I don't think Grams was abusive toward Prue, but they did mention her being pretty hard on her. I also wonder if some of her self-sacrificial behaviors (such as jumping in front of Shax's energy blast instead of trying to tk him or the boom, and jumping into the pit when infected with pride) was some sort of unconscious death wish disguised as bravery or tenacity. In season 3, her astral self literally splits her psyche in two because of the unhappiness she keeps pushing down in favor of the expectations and obligations her conscious self keeps pushing her to live up to. I know it's a bit of a random brain dump, but as someone who studied social work it interests me. Good points! I would've liked to see the show deal with the sisters' mental health more. Prue getting therapy after that episode would be nice. And I agree, I miss the compassion Phoebe showed in earlier seasons. its the same as Phoebe. There was sympathy for her after she fake-vanquished Cole in Sleuthing. I think Alyssa Milano was actually dealing with a depression then in real life. It would have been nice to see Phoebe get therapy at the beginning of Season 5. The Eyes that Have It dealt with this a little as well. There were also 3 pregnancies on Charmed and none had post-partum depression. In a way I could have seen Prue resorting to the bottle like Piper did in Long Live the Queen after losing Phoebe to the underworld. I dont know how Prue could have come to peace with herself in Season 4 if she did survive. She even said in Just Harried that she felt she had no purpose now that Piper and Phoebe had partners. Ad that to Pipers new power being more defensive and combative than hers, she would have felt so redundant - even after getting Phoebe back from Cole/the Underworld. I think Prue would have ended up with Phoebe, a workaholic and endlessly dating bad men. |
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Post by Melinda Halliwell on Jun 16, 2021 2:48:07 GMT -5
And that I wouldn't have liked to have seen which pains me when I say I'm glad Prue wasn't around post-season 3 then but yeah dealing with mental health would've been a good subject matter to portray in the show.
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Post by Elle Em on Jun 16, 2021 8:56:10 GMT -5
I dont know how Prue could have come to peace with herself in Season 4 if she did survive. She even said in Just Harried that she felt she had no purpose now that Piper and Phoebe had partners. Ad that to Pipers new power being more defensive and combative than hers, she would have felt so redundant - even after getting Phoebe back from Cole/the Underworld. I think Prue would have ended up with Phoebe, a workaholic and endlessly dating bad men. Prue and Phoebe both had bold personalities and were more similar than different at times. Both ended up acting more like the other at some point. In the Morality Bites future, Phoebe died young and Prue was a workaholic. In their actual future, that's reversed. Prue also became increasingly reckless the year before her death, a very Phoebe-like trait. |
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rebooted
Witch
Started watching at 12
Posts: 1,803
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Post by rebooted on Jun 16, 2021 18:05:43 GMT -5
And that I wouldn't have liked to have seen which pains me when I say I'm glad Prue wasn't around post-season 3 then but yeah dealing with mental health would've been a good subject matter to portray in the show. i think that is what made the earlier seasons better because they did make the characters relatable. The fears episode and even when Piper is dealing with morality and what it means to be a witch. Is she bad or good. |
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