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Post by Phoenix on Jun 10, 2015 12:32:52 GMT -5
Hi.
Charmed isn't airing in my country for quite a few years on TV, so for the first time in my life, I decided to rewatch the whole series online.
Finished with season 3 today, but the ending of the final episode All Hell Breaks Loose for some reason is missing a scene where Phoebe comes back from the Underworld with Leo thanks to Cole, Leo starts healing Piper & Prue, Piper comes back to life but Prue doesn't. Phoebe asks him "What's wrong?", he says "I can't heal the dead." Piper and Phoebe start crying realising Prue died. I remember this scene perfectly, watched it so many times on TV. However I can't find it ANYWHERE now. Some fans are even saying that scene never existed in the first place?! And others have the same question as I do. When you watch the episode now it lasts only 40 minutes. The original one lasted 42 minutes. So exactly 2 minutes are missing !!
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cyma
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Post by cyma on Jun 10, 2015 15:07:55 GMT -5
My country aired the third season one year after it was over and done with so I saw the AHBL which ends with Shax killing the doctor and the main door's windows shattering. No Leo trying to heal Prue or Phoebe coming back from the Underworld. I thought I would see it in the recap on the episode next day of season four, but nothing. I really think someone should just ask the actors in the next Charmed convention about the existence of this scene. If they acted it out, surely they would have some memory of it. Shannen was directing the episode and she claimed many times it was her favorite so someone should ask her. Here are links below which are discussing the missing scene: en.allexperts.com/q/Charmed-1100/f/Prue-death.htmwww.amazon.com/All-Hell-Breaks-Loose/forum/Fx75NTXDP6TU20/Tx14TDL024MPXN8/1?_encoding=UTF8&asin=B000B5XOW0
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Esmeralda
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Post by Esmeralda on Jun 10, 2015 16:04:00 GMT -5
I just followed this link and the latest comment is supposedly from Jeannie Marie Campion. Anyone wondering, I'd never post something like that and if I was going to post in that thread, I'd always post it as either Esmeralda, Esmeralda Wyatt or JustEs, never as my full name. This person is obviously too cowardly to post under their own name or even their own screen name. I have no idea who this person is or what they have against me - I just hope those who know me know that I would never write with that many grammatical errors. IF I had left a message it would be asking if this is what these fans are remembering: That's not from All Hell Breaks Loose; it's from Be Careful What You Witch For, which fans often use in fanmade videos while using the scenes from "Bride and Gloom" to show Prue dead (strange that she happened to be wearing the same outfit...) Here's the best version of that: www.youtube.com/watch?v=YSVNcnXa3k4That's totally fanmade. Also, why would Shannen ever direct an episode where she dies when she thought she'd be coming back for Season Four until she got her pink slip over the phone while in Canada shooting "One Fine Day" with Julian McMahon? All of that is nothing like what this cowardly fake Jeannie Marie Campion wrote.
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Post by Phoenix on Jun 11, 2015 3:30:28 GMT -5
So even you guys don't believe it's the truth? I see some of those people are saying that a whole episode is missing, that can't be true. Charmed was extremely popular here on the Balkans, I watched it on Croatian, Serbian & Slovenian TV channels all the time (the languages are similiar). Pretty sure I've seen the final scene that's missing more than once !
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cyma
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Post by cyma on Jun 11, 2015 9:02:08 GMT -5
I’m still holding out hope there are the extra minutes you mentioned, which sounds more plausible than a whole episode. I actually recall that Forever Charmed scene in the end with the pictures was actually longer(but unfortunately no picture of Prue, Cole or Darryl. If there was I definitely would’ve remembered). Just younger version of Piper and Phoebe I think. I have no idea why it was shortened. But what I would really like is a confirmation from the actors themselves about AHBL to put all this to rest.
If Shannen’s intention had always been to stay with the show for another season, and we were shown that two minutes you mentioned in AHBL, then what exactly would the season 4 premiere be like? How exactly were they going to bring Prue back to life? There was no Genie this time. Were they going to ask Tempus to reverse time again? Or was it going to be Cole suggesting using the Grimoire which has a spell to resurrect the dead? One which the wizard was going to use to resurrect his people but was vanquished by Phoebe. And then what? The Charmed Ones go dark or something for using dark magic? Or just Phoebe and Cole since the whole Cole becoming the Source arc did seem it was planned.
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Esmeralda
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Post by Esmeralda on Jun 11, 2015 9:47:13 GMT -5
And I will continue to insist that those two minutes were taken off somewhere else in the episode.
I mean even if that happened, how would you ever make a door closing (as *every* season ended) more dramatic than Shax blowing out the door and shattering the glass in the door - the most dramatic ending to a season in the entire series?
It's why I'm postive it doesn't exist. When I first saw that episode, I had no idea that there were problems between Shannen and Alyssa so I had absolutely no idea that one of them might leave - after Shax blew out the door, I sat there for a good ten minutes, my chin figuratively hitting the floor, in shock, positive that all three Charmed Ones were dead and that's how the series was going to end! (I still wish it *had* ended there - as far as I'm concerned it did, since S4 starts the alternate-universe spin-off, "The Perils of Poor, Poor Pitiful Piper" aka "PhoeME and Her Fantasy Men" aka "Two Witches Plus One Living Whitelighter Equals the Power of Three?")
And I wouldn't have felt that way if I thought that any of them were going to survive and that the series was going to continue.
Sorry, thinking that those two missing minutes came after that door closed and the window shattered just doesn't wash.
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Post by Phoenix on Jun 11, 2015 10:37:29 GMT -5
It's hard to start questioning myself when that's something I've believed in for years & years. Did a bit of more research and it could be possible that somehow I saw this fanmade video and it kinda stuck in my mind as the real ending ! www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ThPP3JScR4
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Esmeralda
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Post by Esmeralda on Jun 11, 2015 10:56:33 GMT -5
Yup, there's a number of alternate endings that fans have made roaming around. That one just redoes what happened at the beginning of the episode. I often wish they'd never done it that way so that fans couldn't use it and confuse other fans so much.
Fans *want* there to believe there is more so much, but the footage simply doesn't exist.
No way can anything be more dramatic than Shax saying "The end", killing their innocent (who wasn't such a creep at this point) and then blowing out the door, shattering the glass. If they added anything else, it wouldn't have been even half as dramatic, and for all the problems Brad Kern had with consistency, he knew how to write a dramatic script.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2015 17:40:11 GMT -5
I believe I'll weigh in on this.
I've heard about this "All Hell Breaks Loose Part II" for years. However, no such episode exists.
All Hell Breaks Loose was always meant to end the way it did, with Prue and Piper near death. The episode was already in the can when Shannen got fired. It was a coincidence that said firing happened after we last saw her character near death. It made it very convenient for them to say "Oh, Prue died." when S4 started. Certainly had Shannen been fired after S1 or S2, her absence would have been much harder to explain away. The show got lucky here, but luck was all it was.
After she finished All Hell Breaks Loose (which she also directed, BTW), Shannen came here to Canada to shoot a TV movie called Another Day (which also starred Julian McMahon). Actors often do stuff like this during summer breaks from their shows, making movies (both TV and big screen). It was while she was making this movie that Shannen got a phone call in which she was informed that her services on Charmed were no longer required, or, as a certain business mogul with funny hair would say: "You're fired." (and Kern really was a gutless coward here, wasn't he, not even having the common decency to tell Shannen to her face that she was fired)
That is why S4 started the way it did, with everyone back at the Manor and no mention of how Phoebe, Leo, and Cole got out of the Underworld, where they had been left in All Hell Breaks Loose. The writers had to literally scramble to throw together a new beginning for the season. The Dark Phoebe storyline, which was supposed to open S4, had to be pushed back because they needed to introduce Paige. Watch the Dark Phoebe storyline, and you'll notice that Paige's lines about distrusting Cole sound like something Prue would say. No doubt those lines were originally written for Prue (since this storyline would have had to have been in development when Shannen was fired).
No, Es is right. What those of you who claim to have seen this mythical second part of All Hell Breaks Loose are merely fan made videos that have cropped up on YouTube over the years. You can tell a fan made video, watch how the sisters in those videos suddenly change clothes (because the videos are cropped together from different episodes).
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Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2015 21:52:59 GMT -5
Tim pretty much said it. There is NO "All Hell Breaks Loose, Part 2," and it baffles the mind that so many people still believe there's one after all these years. All Hell Breaks Loose was always meant to end the way it did, with Prue and Piper near death. The episode was already in the can when Shannen got fired. It was a coincidence that said firing happened after we last saw her character near death. It made it very convenient for them to say "Oh, Prue died." when S4 started. Certainly had Shannen been fired after S1 or S2, her absence would have been much harder to explain away. The show got lucky here, but luck was all it was. Now, I HAVE heard that "All Hell Breaks Loose" was written the way it was to potentially write out ANY of the main leads, either Prue or Piper by wall, Phoebe by Source. The behind the scenes drama started happening long before AHBL was written, and there was a chance that one of the leads wouldn't return for Season 4, but they didn't know which one, and no plans were made to fire anyone until after the episode aired. The Patty/Sam backstory that allowed them to write Paige in, on the other hand, that was definitely 100% luck. The original purpose of the Patty/Sam affair was to draw parallels with Piper/Leo. It was merely a coincidence that they were able to later use this story to explain the existence of a fourth sister.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 1, 2015 23:30:22 GMT -5
One is left to wonder what they would have done, had P3H2O not been made. Would they have had to bring in a cousin instead of an unknown sister. Or would they have done what the comics have done, bring Prue back in a different form (played by a different actor, of course).
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Post by Melinda Halliwell on Jul 2, 2015 3:39:54 GMT -5
Would people have accepted Prue played by another actor/actress when Shannen played her for 3 years whom they loved do you think?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2015 11:12:28 GMT -5
I don't know. We might have ended up with The Other Darrin here (look that up at TV Tropes).
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Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2015 11:21:49 GMT -5
Would people have accepted Prue played by another actor/actress when Shannen played her for 3 years whom they loved do you think? I doubt they would've. Even Bewitched was barely able to pull that off with Darrin, and that was back in the 60s (when people expected less from TV shows, in general). I guess one way they could've written in a fourth sister without "P3 H20" was by having it be an older half-sister whom Patty had at 17 or 18 and was forced to give up for adoption. Abortion was still illegal at the time, so that's often what happened to pregnant teens back then; there's an element of realism there. Of course, this Paige would've had to have been played by someone much older (or, at least, older-looking) than Rose McGowan, since she would've been the oldest instead of the youngest. I've heard that Charisma Carpenter was one of the actors considered for Paige, and she's older than Shannen Doherty. (Although, she was still tied to Angel at the time.)
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Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2015 11:48:16 GMT -5
Yeah, I could see them going that way. They needed another sister, and this was one way they could introduce said sister.
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Esmeralda
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Post by Esmeralda on Jul 2, 2015 13:02:32 GMT -5
Would people have accepted Prue played by another actor/actress when Shannen played her for 3 years whom they loved do you think? I doubt they would've. Even Bewitched was barely able to pull that off with Darrin, and that was back in the 60s (when people expected less from TV shows, in general). That's why the comics worked while it wouldn't have worked on the show. When reading the comics, you can imagine "Patience" acting like Prue and certain artists drew "Patience" so her face reminded you of Shannen's. But I can't imagine an actress who could play Prue in such a way that we wouldn't consistently suspect that Prue of being a demon...which would've made a much better storyline! I've read an alternate-universe fanfic where Patty was raped by a demon as a teen, so Paige is half-demon, not half-whitelighter. Now that would've been interesting... I never head that Charisma was considered. But finding someone who's older than the sisters and who looks like a Halliwell and could act like one would probably be easier than finding a younger one. I've been amazed how much Neve Campbell looks like Piper. Not sure of the age, but I can see her acting evil and can imagine her as an older Halliwell. Also, I've always thought it was a shame that Tiffani Thiessen turned down the part of Paige because she didn't want to replace Shannen Doherty again. She would've made a great Paige - either as an older one or a younger one.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2015 17:40:35 GMT -5
Jennifer Love Hewitt was also considered for the fourth sister. However, she turned it down. I'm glad she did, that left her free to assume the lead in another show I really enjoyed, Ghost Whisperer.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2015 19:27:54 GMT -5
I've read an alternate-universe fanfic where Patty was raped by a demon as a teen, so Paige is half-demon, not half-whitelighter. Now that would've been interesting... I'd rather leave rape out of Charmed, but a half-demon sister could've been very interesting. I never head that Charisma was considered. But finding someone who's older than the sisters and who looks like a Halliwell and could act like one would probably be easier than finding a younger one. I've been amazed how much Neve Campbell looks like Piper. Not sure of the age, but I can see her acting evil and can imagine her as an older Halliwell. Also, I've always thought it was a shame that Tiffani Thiessen turned down the part of Paige because she didn't want to replace Shannen Doherty again. She would've made a great Paige - either as an older one or a younger one. Neve Campbell was born on October 3, 1973, so she's younger than Shannen and Alyssa, as well as a month younger than Rose. However, I could see her believably playing an older sister similar to how Holly could believably play an older sister to Alyssa and Rose. Similar goes for Tiffani. She was born on January 23, 1974, making her younger than ALL of them, but she has an older, more mature look to her that could pull off playing an older sister. ( Especially, a part-demon one. Anyone who's seen her as the conniving Valerie on 90210 should know what I mean.) And, both her and Neve are much more comfortable with TV acting than Rose (Tiffani having done Saved by the Bell and BH 90210 and Neve having done Party of Five, while Rose mostly did movies).
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Esmeralda
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Post by Esmeralda on Jul 2, 2015 21:07:25 GMT -5
I've read an alternate-universe fanfic where Patty was raped by a demon as a teen, so Paige is half-demon, not half-whitelighter. Now that would've been interesting... I'd rather leave rape out of Charmed, but a half-demon sister could've been very interesting. *shrug* Since Charmed is is so much about violence, it fits right in. And this is from someone who came close to being raped when she was a teen... Exactly so. If an actress is good, age doesn't truly matter. Exactly so. Choosing someone who was more accustomed to the timing of movies was as bad as choosing a comedic actress to play the dramatic role of Billie.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2015 23:50:05 GMT -5
As I said, the show lucked out here.
Imagine if Shannen, or Holly, or Alyssa, had gotten fired after S1 or S2. The absence of their character would have been a heck of a lot harder to explain away, as neither of those seasons ended the way All Hell Breaks Loose did.
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