Charmed Comics Return in October 2014

[Deleted]

I'm a fan of Cole's and I like how his character has been ended. At least this time he has people mourning him and he went out in a somewhat heroic fashion... I'll take that over "Centennial Charmed" any day. Sure it's sad and harsh, but it was always going to be that way bringing the Ancient Athame into the story. That was the point, to raise the stakes and I appreciate that.

I like that Pat isn't afraid to take risks, that'll keep me reading. So far, I enjoyed season 9 more, but we are only 5 issues in and I'm liking s10 so far. I'm just so thankful that he didn't pander to certain Pholes by having them get back together. That would have been hideous. I read one Phole fan who was hoping Cole would jump into Coop's body so that they could be together . Erm, yeah, because why wouldn't you marry someone who hijacked the body of your husband, the father of your kids? Real love story there!

[Esmeralda]

Feb 20, 2015 18:19:18 GMT -5 @p3nathan said:

I'm a fan of Cole's and I like how his character has been ended. At least this time he has people mourning him and he went out in a somewhat heroic fashion... I'll take that over "Centennial Charmed" any day. Sure it's sad and harsh, but it was always going to be that way bringing the Ancient Athame into the story. That was the point, to raise the stakes and I appreciate that.

I like that Pat isn't afraid to take risks, that'll keep me reading. So far, I enjoyed season 9 more, but we are only 5 issues in and I'm liking s10 so far. I'm just so thankful that he didn't pander to certain Pholes by having them get back together. That would have been hideous. I read one Phole fan who was hoping Cole would jump into Coop's body so that they could be together . Erm, yeah, because why wouldn't you marry someone who hijacked the body of your husband, the father of your kids? Real love story there!

I agree completely totally.

[Darkhorse Christian]

Feb 20, 2015 23:06:49 GMT -5 Esmeralda said:

Feb 20, 2015 18:19:18 GMT -5 @p3nathan said:

I'm a fan of Cole's and I like how his character has been ended. At least this time he has people mourning him and he went out in a somewhat heroic fashion... I'll take that over "Centennial Charmed" any day. Sure it's sad and harsh, but it was always going to be that way bringing the Ancient Athame into the story. That was the point, to raise the stakes and I appreciate that.

I like that Pat isn't afraid to take risks, that'll keep me reading. So far, I enjoyed season 9 more, but we are only 5 issues in and I'm liking s10 so far. I'm just so thankful that he didn't pander to certain Pholes by having them get back together. That would have been hideous. I read one Phole fan who was hoping Cole would jump into Coop's body so that they could be together . Erm, yeah, because why wouldn't you marry someone who hijacked the body of your husband, the father of your kids? Real love story there!

I agree completely totally.

I too concur. Especially since they went the "you are now erased from existence" route with it. Honestly, Cole's atonement became so central to who he was that a heroic sacrifice and/or a decision to say goodbye to the family and go work on his own were the only ways he could go for the story to be workable and do him justice. Combined with the fact that it confirms the threat of the Ancient Athame, subject matter morbidity aside this is actually the best and most fitting of Cole's deaths. Kudos to Patrick Shand indeed.

Also, doubly concur on the hardcore Pholes thing, and good Lord, I hate that term (I don't know why, but portmanteau couple names never appealed to me regarding Charmed ships). Especially given that I'm 75% sure that particular fan wasn't talking about Cole/Coop sharing a body like the DC comics character Firestorm or Ling Yao and Greed from Fullmetal Alchemist—which still would've been uncomfortable, but at least it'd be entertaining.

[Esmeralda]

Well, I got the next issue and you Cole-fans are going to totally love it, especially when it does appear this isn't the last we've seen of Cole Turner. This is especially true of you who think that Belthazor, Half-Face and Cole are all totally different people who all lived in the same body at different time and Cole is completely innocent of everything Belthazor and Half-Face did.

This girl, who loves Charmed, hated it.

I also hate what they're doing to all of the characters. After Paul Ruditis turned them back into characters I love, Pat Shand is turning them all into characters I hate...

I also don't like the artist - it's harder and harder to tell who is who. You have to do it by context, not by looks.

*sigh* Just like when I was watching S5-8, I'll keep buying and reading them, just because I'm curious and because I'm hoping my Charmed Ones come back rather than these imposters like the ones in S5-8, but like that, I'm not expecting it.

[Darkhorse Christian]

Feb 21, 2015 17:44:27 GMT -5 Esmeralda said:

Well, I got the next issue and you Cole-fans are going to totally love it, especially when it does appear this isn't the last we've seen of Cole Turner.

The fact that Prue argued with Cole and said her sisters wouldn't like whatever the green ball was about tells me that it's most likely not meant to be a Cole revival tool. Why would the Halliwells fault him for having a backup to his own life knowing that he's being targeted by someone with a spirit-erasing weapon? The only way I see it being used to bring him back is if the comic starts losing revenue and they absolutely have to bring him back to keep interest before they can get to what the ball was originally meant to be used for.

I think it still is the end for him. I HOPE it's still the end for him. Because if it's not still the end for him, you just worfed the scariest weapon in Charmed history. Pat explicitly said when teasing the plot of the season that he wanted to answer the question of doing something about the Halliwells always cheating death, and the Ancient Athame is as explicit as they come as far as that goes. Cole coming back especially because of that green ball would mean even this thing can be cheated easily. So long, story conflict…

Feb 21, 2015 17:44:27 GMT -5 Esmeralda said:

This is especially true of you who think that Belthazor, Half-Face and Cole are all totally different people who all lived in the same body at different time and Cole is completely innocent of everything Belthazor and Half-Face did.

Half-Face? No, he never lived in Cole's body. The ESSENCE OF THE SOURCE did. Clear and obvious difference there. The ramifications of that difference, however, have been debated here aplenty.

And Belthazor was a part of Cole. Never existed outside of that before. In fact, I can make the argument that mistake number one which helped doom him to the Source's influence was everyone thinking that vanquishing Belthazor the power was in any way freeing him of darkness forever. I can understand two separate personas of the same being, but showing the two as entirely separate beings now…kinda scratching my head here. Especially since they both vanish in the end anyway…

[Esmeralda]

Nope, he's not a part of Cole in the comics, but a totally different character who Cole confronts wherever he happens to be. And unlike when he confronts the Source, this isn't the dream. This is truly a different character, the character that was supposedly exorcised from Cole. So as a half-demon, Cole was possessed by Belthazor his whole life? Oh, give me a freakin' break!

As for whether it was the essence (aka Half-Face, who was the Source, so if the essence of the Source went into Cole, then the essence of Half-Face - aka Half-Face - went into Cole) or the powers of the Source that went into Cole, as you said, that's been debated elsewhere so no need to continue, especially when the writers did such a rotten, inconsistent job with it.

[Deleted]

This issue will piss me off then (still waiting on mine, for some reason delivery is taking longer). I hate when they try to make out that Belthazor is separate, it makes no damn sense. Paige is only half whitelighter, it doesn't mean she's not responsible for the whitelightery things she does; like the moment she's with a charge she's "Whitelighter Paige" and "witch Paige" has nothing to do with it!

It always annoys me in Black As Cole:

Paige: I don't know, I guess it's not my business. Probably just really the fact that Cole killed people.

Piper: Yeah, but that wasn't Cole, it was Belthazor.

Paige: Splitting hairs if you ask me.

Leo: It's not though. His human half had absolutely nothing to do with any of that, it was totally subjugated. Phoebe's right, he's an innocent.

This makes no sense! It contradicts everything we saw in season 3 and even the same episode. Cole shifted into demon form to help the sisters; to protect them, to fight evil.... what sense does that make if Belthazor is a demon he has no sway over? If Cole is responsible for the good Belthazor does, then he's also responsible for the bad; you can't have it both ways!

[Esmeralda]

*nods* Exactly so.

[Deleted]

Okay, finally got the issue today, here are my thoughts.

*First off, glad there were other things going on as opposed to it just being a farewell Cole episode.
*Valen's vanquish seemed a bit anti-climactic to me, but I guess you could argue killing Cole was the climax, he certainly seemed to think so. But really, if they had a depowering spell all along, what took them so long?
*The stuff with Cole and Belthazor annoyed me for reasons I've already posted; one thing I forgot to mention in my rant though was that it also contradicts what Cole himself said in season 9 and tried to relinquish all responsibility that Cole took for it. Kudos to Eliza Feliz on the art though, looked pretty cool.
*So Cole is dead dead. As I said before, I'm fine with this, it's a decent ending for him. So I expect that to be honored. I'll put up with a flashback or something, but no ghosts, no ressurections, no possessions... DEAD, okay?
*Prue's tattoos are interesting. The "stay away from her" appeared when she was talking to Piper hmm. Definitely seems to be Phoebe who has the biggest issue though since she didn't say a word to her... which makes me think Prue and Cole may have had a thing; although if that was the case I'd wonder why Phoebe seems A-ok with Cole but won't talk to Prue, so maybe it's something else.
*Having Prue and Coop in on the secret is pretty neat. I just like seeing Prue interact more with one of her brothers in law other than Leo.

So yeah, it was an okay issue. Could've done without the Belthazor stuff, but at least they didn't pull some way to save Cole out of their asses. I'm far more interested in what's going on with Prue more than anything else and what Coop will do with Benjamin's soul....which is why I find it a bit frustrating that we have a Phoebe one shot before the next arc starts :/ Then again I loved the one shots last season, so we'll see.

[Deleted]

You guys seen the new cover?



Definitely got the impression Belthazor was dead, as in the not coming back kind... so can't say I'm thrilled with this one. 

[Esmeralda]

I'm not surprised. When they show Coop wondering about it at the end, you just knew they'd do something to bring Cole back. But rather than Cole, let's bring back Belthazor so he can be a Big Bad without it being Cole.

*YAWN*

ETA: I just hope they don't use this to let Phoebe convince Belthazor that he's really a good guy and she falls for him and leave Coop for him. I'm still in the mode of the instant Phoebe leaves Coop for any verison of Cole (or if Coop in self-sacrificing mode, leaves Phoebe), I'll stop reading the comics - ditto if Henry leaves Paige. Now if Leo leaves Piper, I'll celebrate!

And if the reason why Piper and Phoebe seem distant from Prue is due to some affair between Cole and Prue, for sure I'll quit.

[Darkhorse Christian]

...UGH.

This whole turn of events regarding Belthazor offends me AS A COLE FAN. Why? Because the big thing that draws me to his character ISN'T "oh, he never really did any of those bad things," it's the fact that he became genuinely capable of atonement and redemption for those evil deeds DESPITE THE ODDS of it! Absolving his responsibility through anything short of Christ Himself, let alone through this half-cocked literal split personality storyline which the show literally contradicted while pretending at times that it didn't, completely misses the point and takes away from the gravity and depth of the Cole Turner character.

The idea that Phoebe could enter a "making Belthazor realize he can actually be good and has been at times" storyline isn't a problem to me because of the threat of her leaving Coop for him. (Though it seems less impossible now than it did before, I'm still not classing it as likely yet.) It's a problem to me because Cole and Belthazor are not supposed to be two different beings, but two halves of the same whole, and thus this conclusion should already be considered a given.

I sincerely hope this Belthazor turns out to be a fake, an imitator of his form greeting Cole on the other side with mind games and now getting ready to make his move on the Charmed Ones. Otherwise, I'm changing my prediction, they are gonna bring Cole back (SOMEHOW), and it's going to lead to something completely stupid that tarnishes the perfect ending that Shand just frickin' gave him.

I'd rather see Kira brought back brainwashed to be used as some villain's seer and then freed from their control before moving forward in peace. Why can't we have that instead of wearing out Cole's story beyond its vitality again? Stop turning my favorite character into John Cena!

[Esmeralda]

The amazing part about it is if that was true, I would also be a Cole-fan. Had he never been possessed, but always simply influenced - AND THEN ACCEPTED HIS FAULT IN DOING SO FOR THE LAST ALMOST-100 YEARS (the same way Little Miss Itsnevermyfault aka Phoebe Halliwell never did (outside of Morality Bites, all part of why I wish my favorite episode had never been a part of Charmed))- he'd be my favorite male character instead of one of my least-favorites. Just like had Chris been written differently; just like had Billie been written differently; just like if Prue, Piper, Phoebe and Leo had been written differently than they were after "Sleuthing with the Enemy".

Unfortunately we have to go with what we're given... And you add that to the fact that I get the distinct feeling that Pat Shand is a Phole fan (I also hate those adjectives, but they are what they are...) and it's why I SO wish Paul Ruditis hadn't quit writing the comics, even as I wonder why as the editor he lets Pat Shand get away with it.

Now as I keep pointing out, the comics have fooled me again and again and again. So hopefully I'm looking at this totally wrong.

But I sincerely don't think so.

DHC, you have or have not actually read the comics? I'm trying to decide if your comments are based on what you've read here or what you've actually read in the comics - because there's always a possibility that I'm reading them wrong...as has already happened this "season" when Cole being the one who died was the last thing on my mind...

[Deleted]

Mar 6, 2015 11:59:54 GMT -5 Esmeralda said:

I'm not surprised. When they show Coop wondering about it at the end, you just knew they'd do something to bring Cole back. But rather than Cole, let's bring back Belthazor so he can be a Big Bad without it being Cole.

*YAWN*

ETA: I just hope they don't use this to let Phoebe convince Belthazor that he's really a good guy and she falls for him and leave Coop for him. I'm still in the mode of the instant Phoebe leaves Coop for any verison of Cole (or if Coop in self-sacrificing mode, leaves Phoebe), I'll stop reading the comics - ditto if Henry leaves Paige. Now if Leo leaves Piper, I'll celebrate!

And if the reason why Piper and Phoebe seem distant from Prue is due to some affair between Cole and Prue, for sure I'll quit.

I really hope they don't bring Belthazor back to be a big bad, I've heard quite a bit of discussion about that. I can't really understand why so many people seem to be intrigued by the notion of it. Sure Belthazor was pretty powerful, but he was hardly close to the worst demon they faced... he was a big deal in season 3. I really can't see why he'd be such a threat to them at this point; they should be able to make that vanquishing potion in their sleep by now.

I also thought that the animosity with Prue may have been something happening between her and Cole. Although if that is the case, I already have issues with how it's being played. Because everyone seemed pretty much fine with Cole, so if only Prue is getting grief for it, I'd have a problem with that. Hoping it's something else

Darkhorse Christian- Don't know if you heard, but it sounds like Kyra might be making an appearance at some stage.

[StoryGirl83]

Feb 23, 2015 1:03:27 GMT -5 Darkhorse Christian said:

The fact that Prue argued with Cole and said her sisters wouldn't like whatever the green ball was about tells me that it's most likely not meant to be a Cole revival tool. Why would the Halliwells fault him for having a backup to his own life knowing that he's being targeted by someone with a spirit-erasing weapon? The only way I see it being used to bring him back is if the comic starts losing revenue and they absolutely have to bring him back to keep interest before they can get to what the ball was originally meant to be used for.

I think it still is the end for him. I HOPE it's still the end for him. Because if it's not still the end for him, you just worfed the scariest weapon in Charmed history. Pat explicitly said when teasing the plot of the season that he wanted to answer the question of doing something about the Halliwells always cheating death, and the Ancient Athame is as explicit as they come as far as that goes. Cole coming back especially because of that green ball would mean even this thing can be cheated easily. So long, story conflict…

Hi, I know it's been a couple of weeks since you posted this, but I wanted to respond and I'm not around nearly as much as I'd like so I haven't read the forum much lately. I haven't seen you around before, so welcome to the site. It's always cool to see new faces and get their opinions. Without all these different opinions, discussions would be so boring.

I'm kind of obsessed with some of the Charmed characters (aren't we all or we wouldn't be here) and this is all about one of my biggest obsessions. If you remember in Charmed Season Ten Issue #2, Magically Malicious, Cole goes to a cupboard and tells something glowing green "Soon" and then later in the issue he brings it to Prue, telling her that it's his father's soul and that he is going to bring his father back, Prue didn't think it was a good idea. What he shows her then is a green orb. It's that which Prue puts in Coop's pocket and discusses with him at the end of issue five. She's basically asking Coop to, even though she doesn't think it's a good idea and she doesn't think her sisters will think its a good idea, to bring back not Cole Turner, but Benjamin Turner. The green orb isn't a tool at all. It's a soul, a Turner soul to be sure, but not Cole's.

Seeing as Pat Shand has stated flat out that Cole is gone and Belthazor is gone. They might show up in flashbacks, in fact Cole definitely will, but they are gone, a Cole revival tool would be kind of useless and ultimately a waste of pages since we have so few in comics and it would end in failure.

[StoryGirl83]

Feb 20, 2015 18:19:18 GMT -5 @p3nathan said:

I'm a fan of Cole's and I like how his character has been ended. At least this time he has people mourning him and he went out in a somewhat heroic fashion... I'll take that over "Centennial Charmed" any day. Sure it's sad and harsh, but it was always going to be that way bringing the Ancient Athame into the story. That was the point, to raise the stakes and I appreciate that.

I like that Pat isn't afraid to take risks, that'll keep me reading. So far, I enjoyed season 9 more, but we are only 5 issues in and I'm liking s10 so far. I'm just so thankful that he didn't pander to certain Pholes by having them get back together. That would have been hideous. I read one Phole fan who was hoping Cole would jump into Coop's body so that they could be together . Erm, yeah, because why wouldn't you marry someone who hijacked the body of your husband, the father of your kids? Real love story there!

Hey, welcome to the Café. It's always nice to see familiar faces.

I agree with you on the marrying someone who hijacked the body of your husband. Definitely creepy. Problem is, this is a little more complicated that that, since Cole is her first husband, he first love. I still don't think that would work out, but it does complicate things when you think about who would be doing the hijacking. I'm very glad that this isn't what happened.

[StoryGirl83]

Feb 23, 2015 6:50:28 GMT -5 Esmeralda said:

Nope, he's not a part of Cole in the comics, but a totally different character who Cole confronts wherever he happens to be. And unlike when he confronts the Source, this isn't the dream. This is truly a different character, the character that was supposedly exorcised from Cole. So as a half-demon, Cole was possessed by Belthazor his whole life? Oh, give me a freakin' break!

As for whether it was the essence (aka Half-Face, who was the Source, so if the essence of the Source went into Cole, then the essence of Half-Face - aka Half-Face - went into Cole) or the powers of the Source that went into Cole, as you said, that's been debated elsewhere so no need to continue, especially when the writers did such a rotten, inconsistent job with it.

I just thought I'd chime in here with what Pat had to say on that. Pat said that the conversation between Cole and Belthazor was all in his mind and implied (though refused to state straight out) that it's very possible that it was just Cole's mind grasping at straws that maybe if he embraced Belthazor he'd be able to make it out of this alive, but that it was still just Cole having a conversation in his head with himself.

This kind of behavior from an author really annoys me and makes me mad at times. And it's not just Pat. Paul did it, too. It's that attitude of "I'll let the readers decide what really happened." Hello! You are the writer. Something actually happened. Be clear. I hate that about him and Paul. It's not up to the reader to decide. Something concrete happened and you know what it was. Be clear. It would be one thing if he needed to be vague because of something coming up, but he's been very clear that Cole isn't coming back from this, so there is no need for that. Part of an author's job is to finish a story with all the loose ends tied up that aren't needed for another story coming up. If you can't tie that loose end, then you don't need that piece of the story.

[Esmeralda]

Mar 8, 2015 17:30:17 GMT -5 StoryGirl83 said:

Feb 23, 2015 6:50:28 GMT -5 Esmeralda said:

Nope, he's not a part of Cole in the comics, but a totally different character who Cole confronts wherever he happens to be. And unlike when he confronts the Source, this isn't the dream. This is truly a different character, the character that was supposedly exorcised from Cole. So as a half-demon, Cole was possessed by Belthazor his whole life? Oh, give me a freakin' break!

As for whether it was the essence (aka Half-Face, who was the Source, so if the essence of the Source went into Cole, then the essence of Half-Face - aka Half-Face - went into Cole) or the powers of the Source that went into Cole, as you said, that's been debated elsewhere so no need to continue, especially when the writers did such a rotten, inconsistent job with it.

I just thought I'd chime in here with what Pat had to say on that. Pat said that the conversation between Cole and Belthazor was all in his mind and implied (though refused to state straight out) that it's very possible that it was just Cole's mind grasping at straws that maybe if he embraced Belthazor he'd be able to make it out of this alive, but that it was still just Cole having a conversation in his head with himself.

This kind of behavior from an author really annoys me and makes me mad at times. And it's not just Pat. Paul did it, too. It's that attitude of "I'll let the readers decide what really happened." Hello! You are the writer. Something actually happened. Be clear. I hate that about him and Paul. It's not up to the reader to decide. Something concrete happened and you know what it was. Be clear. It would be one thing if he needed to be vague because of something coming up, but he's been very clear that Cole isn't coming back from this, so there is no need for that. Part of an author's job is to finish a story with all the loose ends tied up that aren't needed for another story coming up. If you can't tie that loose end, then you don't need that piece of the story.

I agree with you on that. If that conversation was truly supposed to be inside Cole's head, Pat did a horrendous job showing it - and if neither Cole or Belthazor are going to show up again - then that next cover is extremely misleading. It almost feels like he's pulling a Kern - I do one thing one way, fans don't like it, so I try to spin it a different way. Not a good way of writing at all!

As usual, we'll have to wait and see what happens in the next issue. For your sake, StoryGirl, I hope Pat concentrates more on Benjamin Turner's soul than Cole Turner's....and, yes, for my sake, too. Pat Shand is still skating on extremly thin ice and after how wonderful Season 9 was, that's a huge disappoinment - like most fans going from Season Four to Season Five or this fan going from before "Sleuthing with the Enemy" to after it.

[Deleted]

Well I read the latest issue and I actually rather enjoyed it. The wisp was a good spooky addition and the moment with Phoebe and PJ was nice and heartfelt. Interested to see where this Old One story line goes. I also thought it was a good use of Phoebe's empathy; the comics have definitely delivered far more interesting ways for her to use that power than the show ever did IMO.
The only thing I can think of that might of improved it was if they'd just stayed with Phoebe and PJ at the hotel. The bits with the other characters elsewhere just seemed forced in for the sake of having them in the issue, they weren't really needed... and space is precious in a small comic, it could've been used to get more backstory on the wisp.

As I said before though, I'm still most interested in what's going on with Prue and her brief scene at the end of this issue made me even more so.

[StoryGirl83]

Mar 28, 2015 11:06:16 GMT -5 @p3nathan said:

Well I read the latest issue and I actually rather enjoyed it. The wisp was a good spooky addition and the moment with Phoebe and PJ was nice and heartfelt. Interested to see where this Old One story line goes. I also thought it was a good use of Phoebe's empathy; the comics have definitely delivered far more interesting ways for her to use that power than the show ever did IMO.
The only thing I can think of that might of improved it was if they'd just stayed with Phoebe and PJ at the hotel. The bits with the other characters elsewhere just seemed forced in for the sake of having them in the issue, they weren't really needed... and space is precious in a small comic, it could've been used to get more backstory on the wisp.

As I said before though, I'm still most interested in what's going on with Prue and her brief scene at the end of this issue made me even more so.

According to Pat Shand, his original idea for that story was a three issue mini-series staring Piper and Melinda. Frankly, I'm very glad that he used Phoebe and PJ instead, but it would have been nice to have all three issues worth of story there. It's the only issue this season that has really gotten me to pay attention. I know Pat Shand has that ability to tell some killer stories, but I don't feel he's been doing very good at that with Charmed. Even this issue was more, the potential is there and then not. I'm disappointed in that, but it at least gives me hope for the future of the season.