Why couldn't Chris heal?

[lilchi7212]

Aug 12, 2015 5:27:03 GMT -5 @tim66 said:

a Phoenix Witch

Ah yes, their "rise from Salem's ashes".  Pure rubbish, of course.  In Salem, witches were hanged (and one poor soul was crushed to death between two stones), not burned.

We know!

[Deleted]

This is one thing I can't fault Kern for.  Connie Burge made that same mistake with the Witch Is Back.  Critical Research Failure here.

[lilchi7212]

Aug 12, 2015 11:01:12 GMT -5 @tim66 said:

This is one thing I can't fault Kern for.  Connie Burge made that same mistake with the Witch Is Back.  Critical Research Failure here.

It's fantasy they can do what they darn well please.

[Deleted]

When mentioning real life historical events, you should try to get your facts right.

[cyma]

Aug 11, 2015 23:28:12 GMT -5 lilchi7212 said:

Bianca was a Phoenix Witch not a demon and I think another reason why Chris couldn't heal was he probably never had that power in the first place. Just b/c Paige and Wyatt have the power to heal doesn't mean Chris has to have that power. Chris could be an exception.

Been awhile since I watched, but Phoenix witches do possess powers associated with demons like energyball and shimmering. But then again in Season 6, Richard and his family also began throwing energyballs so…yeah

The thing is whitelighter powers are pretty standard. Orb, sense and heal. So it’s more of Chris can’t tap into healing rather than he doesn’t have it. Except for Wyatt, access to healing seems to be a problem at first for half-whitelighters or those who switched whitelighter powers. Though why it isn’t for full whitelighters especially when the charges they’re saving are complete strangers to them and love is the trigger kinda boggles me.

[cyma]

Aug 12, 2015 1:14:44 GMT -5 Sadrick said:

Sam healed himself? Wasn't it already established in previous seasons that Whitelighters couldn't heal themselves? This sounds like another contradiction in the long list of blunders made in Charmed. 

Not physical wounds so thankfully not a blunder for once. Here’s the transcript:

Phoebe: He'll be here soon. He will, just hang on. (Sam orbs in with Piper. He sees Paige and rushes to her side. He holds his hands above Paige but nothing happens.) What's the problem?
Samuel: I can't.
Piper: What? Try again.
Samuel: It's no use. This is my punishment.
Piper: No, you will not sit there and drown in self pity while Paige and my husband die.
Samuel: Don't you think I wanna save them? For god's sake, this is my daughter.
Phoebe: You can't heal her because you gave up.
Samuel: Everything I touch I hurt. All I wanted was a life for her free from magic and demons.
Piper: No, it was not. Paige saved us. She is the reason I am still standing here, she brought this family back together.
Phoebe: She has done so much good. All the pain and anger you've been hanging on for so many years, you've got to let it go. It's time to let it go.
Samuel: Paige, I am so sorry.
Paige: It's okay.
(Paige touches Sam and a blue orbing light surrounds him. The light vanishes to reveal a clean, shaven Sam.)
Samuel: What happened?
Phoebe: I think you just healed yourself. Now Paige.
(He holds his hands above Paige and heals her.)

I guess love isn't enough if you're carrying years worth of pain and anger and drowning yourself in alcohol everyday.

I don't see how the manner in which Bianca died would deter Chris from at least trying. She was impaled by a wooden stake. Unless there's something else about the incident that I can't recall.

Chris never tried. Wyatt was unconscious, Bianca was still alive so he had time to atleast try, but he didn’t.

[Deleted]

Bianca was still alive so he had time to atleast try, but he didn’t.

I guess that, since that whole future was going to be wiped out, he didn't bother. 

I have to wonder if Chris met Bianca in the Wyatt is good future.

[ljones]

I have always been confused about Paige and Chris' ability or lack of ability to heal. I simply stopped bothering to think about it.

[lilchi7212]

Aug 15, 2015 7:29:40 GMT -5 @tim66 said:

Bianca was still alive so he had time to atleast try, but he didn’t.

I guess that, since that whole future was going to be wiped out, he didn't bother. 

I have to wonder if Chris met Bianca in the Wyatt is good future.

That or else he blames himself for all of the loses in  his future and maybe even for Wyatt turning. But I don't know,maybe the writers wanted the fans to decide.

[Assassin Witch]

I need a rewatch of CC (oh, darn, what a hardship for me....). But didn't Chris need to return to the past? He didn't have time to try to heal her? And the purpose of his going to the past was to change the future, so there was no "point" in trying. And if he tried, I imagine that Bianca would have tried to stop him from "wasting time". She was goal-oriented. Willing to sacrifice herself as long as Chris could do his part.

(Also, C/B would always find each other. Hush now.)

[Chrisaholic]

Totally agree with you here, Assassin Witch. In the future, with Wyatt waking up again, Chris had no time to heal Bianca if he'd wanted to. Maybe he learns to heal in the new future but that's something we don't ever find out!

[Melinda Halliwell]

I wonder if the writers secretly decided not to give Chris healing to show that he had an inferiority complex with Wyatt being how more powerful he was than Chris was when he came back in the past which would fit in the conversation he had with Piper about Wyatt having powers in the womb.

I also had a theory which proved wrong that Chris had more powers than he did in the past when he was in the future healing included but then Bianca either stripped those or Wyatt did through some spell or potion not getting the rest through some distraction or other leaving Chris with what he had left but as I said I was proved wrong so that's that there then.

[Aaeiyn]

I don't think he ever learned. It took Paige 4 seasons, before she learned to heal, without having an escort (via Leo).

[aggiefan12]

I go with the writing of his character in Charmed

[zachary]

Jul 10, 2015 9:08:37 GMT -5 Esmeralda said:

If he cared that much he wouldn't have talked so coarsely about the way she was going to conceive him during "I Dream of Phoebe". The only time he seemed to have any emotion towards her was when he was talking to Victor about her death, the same time he proved he'd lied about Paige being killed by the Titans - and we know that that's a lie since the tour guide (only one from the future we can trust) said that all three were vanquished, and the Titans kill by sucking out their life-force; they don't vanquish. Besides, the way she says it makes it clear that they were vanquished together. I think he knew that's what would get to Victor, the same way telling Piper that there was no such thing as family in the future was the best way to get to her.

No, he never loved her at all. And why not? After Prue died she was no longer a loveable person.

Out of curiosity, if they were vanquished, are we to assume that they turned evil? Weird phrasing to say they were vanquished, unless it was just a play-on-words.

I like this theory, but for my headcannon, I'll say that Chris didn't lie about anything, but his future changed as he changed it. So maybe Paige did die in his future from the Titans, but he came back and saved her. Maybe Piper did die when he turned 14, but he changed the future. We saw an old Phoebe in S4, suggesting that she survived all this time and was more than likely- based on info we get from Chris- the lone survivor. 

OR who knows? Maybe Wyatt killed them.

Time-travel and future-jargin is so confusing with Charmed, lol

[Aaeiyn]

Aug 10, 2023 5:43:59 GMT -5 zachary said:

Out of curiosity, if they were vanquished, are we to assume that they turned evil? Weird phrasing to say they were vanquished, unless it was just a play-on-words.

I think it's the latter. In the Charmed-verse, "vanquished" just means "died".

Aug 10, 2023 5:43:59 GMT -5 zachary said:

for my headcannon, I'll say that Chris didn't lie about anything, but his future changed as he changed it. So maybe Paige did die in his future from the Titans, but he came back and saved her. Maybe Piper did die when he turned 14, but he changed the future. We saw an old Phoebe in S4, suggesting that she survived all this time and was more than likely- based on info we get from Chris- the lone survivor.

OR who knows? Maybe Wyatt killed them.

Considering, the two scenes we have with him saying Paige died at the hands of the Titans but then in S6E18 "Spin City" says he goes to Paige for money, one HAS to be lie, and IMO, the lie is that Paige dies at the hands of the Titans. Seeing as how he has lied, MULTIPLE times, throughout the show, that it's silly to think he hasn't lied...

Old Phoebe form S4E14 "The Three Faces of Phoebe" is probably from a different timeline. Chris, himself, is from a certain timeline, throughout S5E22 "Oh My Goddess, Pt 1" - S6E23 "It's a Bad, Bad, Bad, Bad World, Pt 2". And, the Chris we see in S8E22 "Forever Charmed" is from a different timeline, separate from the S5E22 "Oh My Goddess, Pt 1" - S6E23 "It's a Bad, Bad, Bad, Bad World, Pt 2" Chris.

Aug 10, 2023 5:43:59 GMT -5 zachary said:

Time-travel and future-jargin is so confusing with Charmed, lol

Which is pretty funny 'cause most of the episodes I don't care for are Time-Travel based. The only exception being S3E4 "All Halliwell's Eve", since it gave historical meaning to Halloween instead of JUST about reversing time/changing history. I don't care for those lessons. Such a cheap solution, if I'm gonna be honest, but I digress.

That being said, it's important to note, which timeline each setting is pulled from, as not all of them share the same one especially based off of their choices made. As we can see, not even the S2E2 "Morality Bites" future was actually achieved due to Piper eating the chocolates in S4E16 "The Fifth Halliwheel" and applying what the Seer saw to her own destiny.

As the Angel of Destiny stated in S8E10 "Vaya Con Leos", there are many destinies, and I always believe in parallel worlds, as S6E22-23 "It's a Bad, Bad, Bad, Bad World, Pt 1 & 2" kinda explained, in the choices we make gives us a different world/version of the same characters.

[Aaeiyn]

All that being said, I have a new theory, after doing a full re-watch of S7 recently, and Leo writing in the BOS for his sons to learn how to heal, I (also) believe that Paige couldn't have learned how to heal, properly until AFTER his entry.

Though, I'd like to point out, that Wyatt didn't need Daddy Leo to write in the BOS about how to heal. S7E16 "The Seven Year Witch" should've been a great moment to teach baby Chris how to heal, as Wyatt has been healing since the womb via S5E2 "A Witch's Tail, Pt 2", S5E3 "Happily Ever After", S5E6 "The Eyes Have it", etc. And, due to Chris being so angry at Leo, I don't think Chris is gonna learn how to heal due to his daddy issues.

[zachary]

Aug 14, 2023 22:04:47 GMT -5 Aaeiyn said:

Aug 10, 2023 5:43:59 GMT -5 zachary said:

Out of curiosity, if they were vanquished, are we to assume that they turned evil? Weird phrasing to say they were vanquished, unless it was just a play-on-words.

I think it's the latter. In the Charmed-verse, "vanquished" just means "died".

Aug 10, 2023 5:43:59 GMT -5 zachary said:

for my headcannon, I'll say that Chris didn't lie about anything, but his future changed as he changed it. So maybe Paige did die in his future from the Titans, but he came back and saved her. Maybe Piper did die when he turned 14, but he changed the future. We saw an old Phoebe in S4, suggesting that she survived all this time and was more than likely- based on info we get from Chris- the lone survivor.

OR who knows? Maybe Wyatt killed them.

Considering, the two scenes we have with him saying Paige died at the hands of the Titans but then in S6E18 "Spin City" says he goes to Paige for money, one HAS to be lie, and IMO, the lie is that Paige dies at the hands of the Titans. Seeing as how he has lied, MULTIPLE times, throughout the show, it's silly to think he hasn't lied...

But that first part aids in my theory anyways, if he saved her life in "Oh My Goddess", thus changing the future (his past) to where he was then able to go to Paige for money since she was alive in his new timeline. There's nothing to suggest that he wouldn't automatically adapt to the changes in his new timeline, or recognize his previous timeline before he changed it. Paige being alive wouldn't stop Chris from going to the past to save Wyatt, if all the Charmed Ones were seemingly vanquished in his timeline regardless, so it's not too much of a reach, if a reach at all, to theorize that the future changed once he saved Paige. Speculations or not, I can't say 100% for certain that anything he said was a lie, since it wasn't clarified or canonically stated so in the show. As far as I'm concerned, either the writers messed up, or the future (Chris's past) changed. With all the various ways time-traveled is utilized, it's silly to not to consider that he was telling the truth both times.

Aug 14, 2023 22:04:47 GMT -5 Aaeiyn said:

Old Phoebe form S4E14 "The Three Faces of Phoebe" is probably from a different timeline.

More than likely still an extremely similar timeline, if Cole was vanquished in both timelines anyways. Only difference is that Phoebe didn't marry Cole in Old Phoebe's timeline. It's entirely plausible that the sister's being vanquished didn't have to be literal nor concurrent; it's possible that Paige died from the Titans, Piper died from however when Chris turns 14, and Phoebe either dies as an old woman in hiding, or dies some other way in this new timeline.

Aug 14, 2023 22:09:39 GMT -5 Aaeiyn said:

All that being said, I have a new theory, after doing a full re-watch of S7 recently, and Leo writing in the BOS for his sons to learn how to heal, I (also) believe that Paige couldn't have learned how to heal, properly until AFTER his entry.

That's an okay headcannon, but it doesn't work for me. When you read what it says, it's really nothing new to learn for someone who's already mastered orbing and discovered the trigger for healing.

Here's the entry:

To my sons, Wyatt and Chris,

Here is some information to assist and guide you
in the discovery of your new found powers.
The apple doesn't fall far from the tree, so
you'll possess all the powers I have, and more.

Good luck...

When you're ready, you'll receive a call from the Elders.
Emotions are tied to your powers, use them to become stronger.
Don't worry, whitelighters can speak the language of their charges,
whatever it is.
Orbing: Concentrate, focus and relax, it'll happen.
Always remember that your family is just as important as your calling.
If you feel out of balance, try meditating, it will help.
Know that love is the key to your healing hands.
Understand that whatever happens in the future, there is good
inside of you

Love,

Dad

Paige already discovered that love was the key. Heck, even Billie called it out near the end of the episode, so even Billie knows what it is .

We really only see her heal a few times after she learns, and I don't think there was much to progress on once you know how to use the power, IMO.

[Aaeiyn]

Aug 15, 2023 0:54:15 GMT -5 zachary said:

that first part aids in my theory anyways, if he saved her life in "Oh My Goddess", thus changing the future (his past) to where he was then able to go to Paige for money since she was alive in his new timeline. There's nothing to suggest that he wouldn't automatically adapt to the changes in his new timeline, or recognize his previous timeline before he changed it. Paige being alive wouldn't stop Chris from going to the past to save Wyatt, if all the Charmed Ones were seemingly vanquished in his timeline regardless, so it's not too much of a reach, if a reach at all, to theorize that the future changed once he saved Paige. Speculations or not, I can't say 100% for certain that anything he said was a lie, since it wasn't clarified or canonically stated so in the show. As far as I'm concerned, either the writers messed up, or the future (Chris's past) changed. With all the various ways time-traveled is utilized, it's silly to not to consider that he was telling the truth both times.

In that very same Goddess episode, both Piper & Leo called out Chris on his deception in knowing that ALL (well, not all, some, but I digress) of the Elders were going to die, and he kept that a secret, to manipulate his way into becoming the Charmed Ones new Whitelighter. And, needed to help push Leo into Elder-ism (IK that's not a word, but you know what I mean), so that Leo can disappear, and Chris takes Leo's place as the Charmed Ones new Whitelighter.

What I said does NOT, in any way, shape or form support (to) your theory. These two statements CANNOT co-exist, at the same time, with ONE singular timeline Chris via the S5E22 "Oh My Goddess, Pt 1" - S6E23 "It's a Bad, Bad, Bad, Bad World, Pt 2" Chris. Where Paige dies by the Titans in his world but somehow can still go to her, for money, post-Titans? That doesn't make ANY sense, whatsoever. ONE of them is a lie and considering how the events happened in S5E22 "Oh My Goddess, Pt 1", I don't trust that Chris was 100% honest, here. Compared to his demeanor in S6E18 "Spin City".

Other examples of Chris lying (or at least admitted to it) is in S6E10 "Chris-Crossed", when he returned back from his future (after Bianca died) to the Charmed Ones, he apologized for lying to them. And, Piper demanded the truth to be told, by him. And, the Charmed Ones were hesitant in him sticking around, afterwards, that Leo had to be the one to make that leeway for Chris to continue hanging around but still encouraging him to be honest, if Chris expects to be trusted.

Chris was not honest about how he obtained the Valkyrie pendants and even lied about why he needed the Empath blocking potion (not for the sisters but a good excuse), see S6E5 "Love's a Witch". And, Leo caught onto him about his dishonesty. Or, in S6E12 "Prince Charmed", how he used Mr. Right to manipulate the Charmed Ones into binding Wyatt's powers and got called out, AGAIN for LYING.

PLENTY of times, throughout the show, Chris has been called out for lying, being dishonest, not telling the truth, etc.

I can't WAIT for the S6 re-watch 'cause it's all there, PLUS it was in the S5 finale, too!

---

So, again, only ONE of these statements is true:
1) Paige was killed by the Titans and unable to be around to be the one Chris goes to, for money.
2) Paige wasn't killed by the Titans and lived long enough to be the one Chris went to, for money before being "vanquished" later on, in Chris' future storyline.

Aug 15, 2023 0:54:15 GMT -5 zachary said:

More than likely still an extremely similar timeline, if Cole was vanquished in both timelines anyways. Only difference is that Phoebe didn't marry Cole in Old Phoebe's timeline. It's entirely plausible that the sister's being vanquished didn't have to be literal nor concurrent; it's possible that Paige died from the Titans, Piper died from however when Chris turns 14, and Phoebe either dies as an old woman in hiding, or dies some other way in this new timeline.

They CANNOT be true, at the same time.

According to what was said in S6E10 "Chris-Crossed", NONE of the Charmed Ones are alive, when this timeline Chris is an adult. Old Phoebe CANNOT exist, in THIS timeline's Chris' future.

Remember what Old Phoebe said in S4E14 "Marry-Go-Round"? She never married Cole and had to vanquish him, in HER timeline. That's a DIFFERENT choice than what THIS timeline Phoebe made. Which ultimately led into a DIFFERENT Piper DESTINY with HER baby, since the chocolates was something that occurred AFTER Phoebe married Cole. This Old Phoebe is a consequence from a different CHOICE. That would NOT lead to THIS timeline Chris' future. As this is a result of a CHOICE made, that did NOT exist in Old Phoebe's timeline. Which means, I don't believe a Wyatt EXISTS in Old Phoebe's timeline.

Aug 15, 2023 0:54:15 GMT -5 zachary said:

That's an okay headcannon, but it doesn't work for me. When you read what it says, it's really nothing new to learn for someone who's already mastered orbing and discovered the trigger for healing.

Here's the entry:

To my sons, Wyatt and Chris,

Here is some information to assist and guide you
in the discovery of your new found powers.
The apple doesn't fall far from the tree, so
you'll possess all the powers I have, and more.

Good luck...

When you're ready, you'll receive a call from the Elders.
Emotions are tied to your powers, use them to become stronger.
Don't worry, whitelighters can speak the language of their charges,
whatever it is.
Orbing: Concentrate, focus and relax, it'll happen.
Always remember that your family is just as important as your calling.
If you feel out of balance, try meditating, it will help.
Know that love is the key to your healing hands.
Understand that whatever happens in the future, there is good
inside of you

Love,

Dad

Paige already discovered that love was the key. Heck, even Billie called it out near the end of the episode, so even Billie knows what it is .

We really only see her heal a few times after she learns, and I don't think there was much to progress on once you know how to use the power, IMO.

Ty for putting it in context! I'd love to highlight something, for you:

When you're ready, you'll receive a call from the Elders

This seems to tie in with the powers, as well, and Paige didn't begin getting "calls from the Elders" until about S7. She had ONE single Whitelighter mission in S5E9 "Sam I Am", but that was the Elders manipulating the situation to hunt down Sam, and that only Paige would be able to "sense him, properly".

Otherwise, she doesn't truly begin getting assignments from the Elders until about S7 and THEN she learns to heal in S8, coincidentally AFTER Leo wrote about it, in the book.

And, Billie is a S8 character, and she's a bad example for your case. As Leo wrote about healing in the BOS in S7, and she was told to study and memorize the book in S8E3 "Run, Piper, Run", so...she could've just read about it LOL

[zachary]

Aug 15, 2023 1:59:59 GMT -5 Aaeiyn said:

Aug 15, 2023 0:54:15 GMT -5 zachary said:

that first part aids in my theory anyways, if he saved her life in "Oh My Goddess", thus changing the future (his past) to where he was then able to go to Paige for money since she was alive in his new timeline. There's nothing to suggest that he wouldn't automatically adapt to the changes in his new timeline, or recognize his previous timeline before he changed it. Paige being alive wouldn't stop Chris from going to the past to save Wyatt, if all the Charmed Ones were seemingly vanquished in his timeline regardless, so it's not too much of a reach, if a reach at all, to theorize that the future changed once he saved Paige. Speculations or not, I can't say 100% for certain that anything he said was a lie, since it wasn't clarified or canonically stated so in the show. As far as I'm concerned, either the writers messed up, or the future (Chris's past) changed. With all the various ways time-traveled is utilized, it's silly to not to consider that he was telling the truth both times.

In that very same Goddess episode, both Piper & Leo called out Chris on his deception in knowing that ALL of the Elders were going to die, and he kept that a secret, to manipulate his way into becoming the Charmed Ones new Whitelighter. And, needed to help push Leo into Elder-ism (IK that's not a word, but you know what I mean), so that Leo can disappear, and Chris takes Leo's place as the Charmed Ones new Whitelighter.

He never lied about it. He didn't tell them, sure, and he decieved them, sure, but he didn't lie. He even states in Part 1 to Phoebe:

Phoebe: You knew the Titans were after the Elders, didn't you? Why didn't you tell us?

Chris: I told you, there's some things I can't tell you. Some things you need to figure out on your own.

Aug 15, 2023 1:59:59 GMT -5 Aaeiyn said:

What I said does NOT, in any way, shape or form support (to) your theory. These two statements CANNOT co-exist, at the same time, with ONE singular timeline Chris via the S5E22 "Oh My Goddess, Pt 1" - S6E23 "It's a Bad, Bad, Bad, Bad World, Pt 2" Chris. Where Paige dies by the Titans in his world but somehow can still go to her, for money, post-Titans? That doesn't make ANY sense, whatsoever. ONE of them is a lie and considering how the events happened in S5E22 "Oh My Goddess, Pt 1", I don't trust that Chris was 100% honest, here. Compared to his demeanor in S6E18 "Spin City".

It just doesn't click for me. There are at least eleven proposed theories of time-travel documented today. In Charmed, about 4 of them are used interchangeably and even repurposed by the writers to fit the plot of the episode. It's not a reach to say that when Chris saved Paige, his past began to change to align with the now altered version of his timeline. So yes, in his initial timeline, Paige was dead. As he changed it, with Paige being alive, his past was re-written with her apart of it, and thus, this version of Chris now has memories of going to Paige for money, since Paige is now alive in his current timeline. 

Aug 15, 2023 1:59:59 GMT -5 Aaeiyn said:

PLENTY of times, throughout the show, Chris has been called out for lying, being dishonest, not telling the truth, etc.

I can't WAIT for the S6 re-watch 'cause it's all there, PLUS it was in the S5 finale, too!

I should've rephrased-- "I can't say 100% for certain that anything he said in-regards to Paige being dead in his future was a lie, since it wasn't clarified or canonically stated so in the show." I disregard the other examples as that's not pertaining to the immediate speculation at-hand; whether or not Paige being alive in his future was a lie.

---

Aug 15, 2023 1:59:59 GMT -5 Aaeiyn said:

So, again, only ONE of these statements is true:
1) Paige was killed by the Titans and unable to be around to be the one Chris goes to, for money.
2) Paige wasn't killed by the Titans and lived long enough to be the one Chris went to, for money before being "vanquished" later on, in Chris' future storyline.

I can accept that as your opinion, but I'll die with another one. Paige could've easily been killed in his original timeline, and thus becoming the Paige he goes to for money. Time-travel is so fickle that there's no way to poke holes in that theory.

Aug 15, 2023 1:59:59 GMT -5 Aaeiyn said:

Aug 15, 2023 0:54:15 GMT -5 zachary said:

More than likely still an extremely similar timeline, if Cole was vanquished in both timelines anyways. Only difference is that Phoebe didn't marry Cole in Old Phoebe's timeline. It's entirely plausible that the sister's being vanquished didn't have to be literal nor concurrent; it's possible that Paige died from the Titans, Piper died from however when Chris turns 14, and Phoebe either dies as an old woman in hiding, or dies some other way in this new timeline.

They CANNOT be true, at the same time.

According to what was said in S6E10 "Chris-Crossed", NONE of the Charmed Ones are alive, when this timeline Chris is an adult. Old Phoebe CANNOT exist, in THIS timeline's Chris' future.

Remember what Old Phoebe said in S4E14 "Marry-Go-Round"? She never married Cole and had to vanquish him, in HER timeline. That's a DIFFERENT choice than what THIS timeline Phoebe made. Which ultimately led into a DIFFERENT Piper DESTINY with HER baby, since the chocolates was something that occurred AFTER Phoebe married Cole.

But that's also using non-canonical logic, because I've never seen any material that states Piper became pregnant with Wyatt because she ate the chocolates. Whatever speculations or theories you have, that's not a proven fact, and because of that-- there's no way to say 100% that in old-Phoebe's timeline, there wasn't a Wyatt. This one choice led to an altered state of events for about three-months, or however the span of Marry-Go-Round is to Long Live The Queen, because once Cole was vanquished, we can also speculate that the timelines began to align again since, in both timelines, Cole is vanquished. We can also speculate that Cole somehow came back form the demonic wasteland in both timelines as well. Timelines are altered by more than just one decision. Old-Phoebe coming from a timeline in-which Cole is vanquished before marriage doesn't erase the possibility that old-Phoebe could've just been in-hiding while Wyatt was in power.

Aug 15, 2023 1:59:59 GMT -5 Aaeiyn said:

This Old Phoebe is a consequence from a different CHOICE. That would NOT lead to THIS timeline Chris' future. As this is a result of a CHOICE made, that did NOT exist in Old Phoebe's timeline. Which means, I don't believe a Wyatt EXISTS in Old Phoebe's timeline.

Again, this is all under the assumption that "chocolates" really influenced the baby Piper had. She didn't even conceive Wyatt until roughly 6-weeks later. And even if that's not necessarily an accurate guess, we can assume that she would've been told that she was pregnant by the doctors in "Bite Me", if she was pregnant at the time.

Aug 15, 2023 1:59:59 GMT -5 Aaeiyn said:

Aug 15, 2023 0:54:15 GMT -5 zachary said:

That's an okay headcannon, but it doesn't work for me. When you read what it says, it's really nothing new to learn for someone who's already mastered orbing and discovered the trigger for healing.

Here's the entry:

To my sons, Wyatt and Chris,

Here is some information to assist and guide you
in the discovery of your new found powers.
The apple doesn't fall far from the tree, so
you'll possess all the powers I have, and more.

Good luck...

When you're ready, you'll receive a call from the Elders.
Emotions are tied to your powers, use them to become stronger.
Don't worry, whitelighters can speak the language of their charges,
whatever it is.
Orbing: Concentrate, focus and relax, it'll happen.
Always remember that your family is just as important as your calling.
If you feel out of balance, try meditating, it will help.
Know that love is the key to your healing hands.
Understand that whatever happens in the future, there is good
inside of you

Love,

Dad

Paige already discovered that love was the key. Heck, even Billie called it out near the end of the episode, so even Billie knows what it is .

We really only see her heal a few times after she learns, and I don't think there was much to progress on once you know how to use the power, IMO.

Ty for putting it in context! I'd love to highlight something, for you:

When you're ready, you'll receive a call from the Elders

This seems to tie in with the powers, as well, and Paige didn't begin getting "calls from the Elders" until about S7. She had ONE single Whitelighter mission in S5E9 "Sam I Am", but that was the Elders manipulating the situation to hunt down Sam, and that only Paige would be able to "sense him, properly".

Otherwise, she doesn't truly begin getting assignments from the Elders until about S7 and THEN she learns to heal in S8, coincidentally AFTER Leo wrote about it, in the book.

And, Billie is a S8 character, and she's a bad example for your case. As Leo wrote about healing in the BOS in S7, and she was told to study and memorize the book in S8E3 "Run, Piper, Run", so...she could've just read about it LOL

If that's the case, wouldn't Paige have healed Henry regardless of what she read in the book? Knowing what a trigger is doesn't automatically create that momentum for you. She had to be in the moment of feeling Love in order to trigger her power anyways. One could say Piper mastered the ability the first time she used it. Even with a 3/4 year break, when Piper swapped powers with Leo again in S5, Paige comparability healed unhesitatingly in the few times we see her heal in S8. So again, I don't really think Leo's entry would further progress someone's skill-set with healing. It's very cut and dry.