Esmeralda
Charmed
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Post by Esmeralda on Nov 9, 2014 21:33:18 GMT -5
*nods* Exactly so.
The Charmed Ones' problem is that they started vanquishing demons so often that they began to think that they could decide who was evil and who was good and anyone who they thought was evil, it was okay to vanquish - totally forgetting the lessons of "Morality Bites", the reason why I wish my favorite episode had never aired.
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ljones
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Post by ljones on Nov 18, 2014 2:46:25 GMT -5
And it is this portrayal of magical beings and morality that I'm criticizing. At least "BUFFY" tried to be a lot more ambiguous in its portrayal of magical beings. Which is more than I can say about "CHARMED". And by portraying their enemies - whether they were demons or not - as one-dimensional evil, the writers truly supported the idea of "the Other" as someone or something to be destroyed because that individual wasn't human or "one of us" . In doing so, the series used demons, warlocks, etc. as metaphors of groups that should be destroyed with extreme prejudice. This attitude actually supports the idea of bigotry in my eyes.
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Post by Darkhorse Christian on Nov 18, 2014 17:07:36 GMT -5
And it is this portrayal of magical beings and morality that I'm criticizing. At least "BUFFY" tried to be a lot more ambiguous in its portrayal of magical beings. Which is more than I can say about "CHARMED". And by portraying their enemies - whether they were demons or not - as one-dimensional evil, the writers truly supported the idea of "the Other" as someone or something to be destroyed because that individual wasn't human or "one of us" . In doing so, the series used demons, warlocks, etc. as metaphors of groups that should be destroyed with extreme prejudice. This attitude actually supports the idea of bigotry in my eyes. Personally, I don't believe that the existence of evil incarnate supernatural beings is automatically bigoted or childish, and I doubt I'm the only one here. But that's not even the argument or discussion I plan on getting into here. The real story is about the application of this idea as a rule within a fictional universe. As I said, I don't think the belief is automatically bad, so I'm not automatically bothered by the use of it in fiction. However, there is a standard to making that rule actually function as a storytelling device to identify bad guys in a manner that a viewing audience will gel with, and Charmed failed to live up to it. - First off, any character type classed in a story as all-evil must have a synthetic or supernatural component to it that's distinct from others in its universe in a visibly harmful manner, otherwise the classing has no credibility in the least. Secondly, the conduct and goals of every character of this type must support the rule 100%. Introducing even a single exception as a key contributor to the protagonists' lives or objectives, or even as one or more of the protagonists themselves, automatically destroys the rule's ability to stand as an absolute. In such a case, the exception's resonance must be respected in a way that informs the rule, so that instead of an absolute, it becomes a base assumption which, while still generally correct, can be defied by certain individual cases. If the exceptions occur far too often, or presumed good/neutral character types prove to be generally just as bad as the all-evil types, then the rule's just destroyed altogether. This is especially true in stories where said evil type makes up many of the protagonists' enemies, and where the protagonists themselves have a moral standard that's supposed to set them above most beings in their universe overall.
The problem with Charmed is, the exceptions happened. Cole utterly butchered the rule's ability to remain an absolute in regards to the show's demons. (Brendan Rowe also came along as far as natural born warlocks, but the very existence of those makes absolutely no sense either.) Yet not only did the show have the sisters go back and forth between acknowledging this and informing the rule vs. continuing to treat it as an absolute, they began to take it up against anyone who got in their way, even outside the generally evil categories. And again, "Morality Bites" established that the sisters have a moral standard that sets them apart, not only from the demons, but from many other humans: that their powers must always be used first and foremost to protect the innocent, NOT to punish the guilty. By selectively choosing when to respect the change in the rule, as well as applying it outside of its boundaries, the Charmed Ones ended up breaking their own code. So because the show couldn't balance out flexibility and consistency right, the protags ended up acting like heels far too often.
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Esmeralda
Charmed
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Post by Esmeralda on Nov 19, 2014 8:32:17 GMT -5
Fantastic post, DC - agreed totally. It's why I say the best way to watch the show is to just pretend episode show is a series all of its own that had nothing to do with the other episodes, which is why I liked it best when it wasn't episodic. If Connie Burge and Brad Kern could come up with different rules just to fit the plot of that episode, why should we count it as a series?
Those rules you talk about is ultra-important in a science-fiction/fantasy show - it's what makes the alternate universe (as all fantasy/scifi shows *are* - they don't *have* to follow our universe's rules as long as their own are followed - hence the reason why it's perfectly okay to have a species which is evil, just because it's that species or because by killing, a witch becomes a warlock and is now evil (remember that after you murdered Billie, Charmed Ones - YOU became what you battled - Billie never murdered, unlike her sister. So when you murdered her in the original timeline, you became warlocks, no matter what you did to change the timeline, especially because you did it to save each other, not her - Paige's charge!), there could be a natural-born warlock - just because your parents are evil doesn't make you evil - or worse, the idea that just because he had a mortal father a demon who was raised by his demonic mother and had been a mercenary demon for more than 70 years could suddenly become good) seem real, let us suspend our disbelief.
Charmed very seldom let us do that which is why we had so many WTF moments watching it.
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Post by Darkhorse Christian on Nov 19, 2014 16:17:25 GMT -5
Yes, and now we have a slight schism about the moral validity of the all-evil species rule even existing precisely because it was handled in such an off manner here with the rules changing day-to-day. Going back to Cole, which is kinda becoming redundant, we've seen him be treated differently regarding the rules depending on the episode/season. And you bringing up not just his evil blood, but also his 70+ years as a hitman in the Source's demonic mafia (that's basically what the Brotherhood is), is a great point. This is why we look back at Phoebe and Cole's relationship and conclude that she was immature and idiotic during much of it. For a demon with that much evil history, even trying to become good and redeem himself is a huge adjustment. Her knee-jerk way of handling everything with him, good and bad, was not making things any easier on him or on her sisters. Logically speaking, it should've met with disaster for everyone involved.
This is also part of why I think those of us who see the sisters' faults figure that the angle would've been much better done with Prue. This storyline accounting for Prue's more mature and controlled approach would've been done in a way that conveyed much better to the audience that Cole's transformation truly was something unthinkable. Instead, he's more like the 36-year-old career criminal since he was 17 who wants to disappear and start over somewhere else with a better lifestyle before his enemies on the streets get him.
Heck, even the demons look stupid in hindsight, because his falling for Phoebe so quickly into the job when he was supposed to kill her suggests that in over 100 years of being raised in evil, and over 70 years of being a mercenary killer, they somehow never tested and/or trained him in ways to make sure he could harden his heart when getting close to a human woman. (And he sure as hell never got an assignment to do so before, because if he had then this would've happened a long time ago.) There's a massive avalanche of stupidity to go around here.
As far as the warlocks go, that's another complaint. The rule for them is warlocks are witches who've turned evil and started killing other witches (stealing their powers in the process) as well as innocents. In short, evil witches. Simple enough, right? So why did the show feel the need to throw in evil witches who are not warlocks, even as early as the Connie Burge era? This not only diluted the very concept of warlocks to the point that almost 2/5 of all their appearances were in season 1, it allowed "creative" to pull a bit of covert pandering to academic misandry by having most of the warlocks be male and most of the evil witches they don't call warlocks (such as Christy, for example) be female. Then you add in the "24-hour window for nascent witches" thing which was thrown in for Paige. Which makes NO sense, because it pretends that good and evil operate in people's hearts on some sort of political registration deadline. And to show how little respect the warlock concept was able to retain even by season 4, they don't even bother saying anything about witches becoming warlocks if they choose evil under the conditions of the window.
In fact, your point about the Charmed Ones becoming warlocks in your eyes because they've marked human antagonists for death, including other witches, kinda hits on the money with this. If the rule that evil witches become warlocks was stuck to solidly, and the threat of the sisters becoming warlocks was eminent every time they started to slip off the slope, the show would've been much more solid about remembering that our heroes are supposed to be the good guys.
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Esmeralda
Charmed
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Post by Esmeralda on Nov 19, 2014 18:06:43 GMT -5
The worst part about that is that the Charmed Ones (aka Kern) honestly thought that they were the good guys!
(Hey, DC - have I told you recently how much I've missed you?)
And, yes, I've long since accepted the fact that the Charmed Ones were just as screwed up and inconsistent under Connie as they were under Kern (but not enough that I'll call her Burge) - the way warlocks were treated and what little consequences *Prue and Phoebe* had to face for using magic back to life proves that. An episode that was once one of my favorites "Awakened" is now one of my least-favorites, and I honestly wish my favorite episode "Morality Bites" had never been aired because it influences how I look at other episodes so much..
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ljones
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Post by ljones on Nov 22, 2014 0:41:39 GMT -5
That's why he was such a well written character, until the writers dumped that Crazy Cole crap in the first half of Season Five.
The Halliwells and Leo would have been better received by me if the series was willing to allow them to face their own mistakes and crimes, aside from the Season Two episode, "Morality Bites".
I refuse to accept this idea that Cole or any other demon on the show had "evil blood". I refuse to accept that one-dimensional view of "demons" that have persisted in Western society for so long. Because the idea that "demons" are morally complex has been around a lot longer.
Cole has an evil past and he has committed evil deeds. But guess what? It seems the Halliwells and Leo have committed evil deeds, as well. I can't look at them differently from Cole anymore.
What did you want? One-dimensional characterizations featuring one-dimensional morality? "Train him in ways to make sure he could harden his heart when getting close to a human woman"? Really?
Anyone can become a monster. One doesn't have to be a "demon" or a career criminal to become one. Reality has proven this . . . over and over again. Is it really that bad for a work of fiction to reflect that? Or is it easier to believe that only an "Other" or someone who isn't like "us" should be viewed as irredeemably evil?
I suggest you read the real definition of warlocks to understand why there can be evil witches without being warlocks.
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Post by Darkhorse Christian on Nov 23, 2014 1:17:41 GMT -5
That's why he was such a well written character, until the writers dumped that Crazy Cole crap in the first half of Season Five. The Halliwells and Leo would have been better received by me if the series was willing to allow them to face their own mistakes and crimes, aside from the Season Two episode, "Morality Bites". You won't find too many people disagreeing here either that Season 5 was horrible for Cole's character arc, or that the Halliwells' code established in the lesson from "Morality Bites" spent 6+ years gradually losing value to the point of meaninglessness. I refuse to accept this idea that Cole or any other demon on the show had "evil blood". I refuse to accept that one-dimensional view of "demons" that have persisted in Western society for so long. Because the idea that "demons" are morally complex has been around a lot longer. Cole has an evil past and he has committed evil deeds. But guess what? It seems the Halliwells and Leo have committed evil deeds, as well. I can't look at them differently from Cole anymore. Like it or not, we're talking about a show set and created in Western society, which used that idea of demons as a rule within the series. Furthermore, it's extremely common of fantasy fictional works both East and West to use bloodline/genetic makeup as identifiers to class characters as being at least MORE LIKELY to harbor not only certain powers, but also certain personality traits, or even to be found amongst the good or the bad guys. Having this sort of thing doesn't make a show one-dimensional, nor turn it into an allegory for bigoted genocide. It's a trope most often designed as a middle ground so that not every kill-or-be-killed antagonist in a series needs to either be a soldier for a nebulous organization or have a loaded backstory with 39 different personal tragedies behind why they're a cold-hearted killer. Fact of the matter is, I'm not offended with a story establishing a "bad species" rule in the first place, nor with bringing in exceptions that refute its absoluteness. (I don't have Cole and Kira in my sig just for kicks and giggles, you know.) Heck, I'm not even offended with having the rule put in place only to be totally deconstructed later, as I've seen in other series. These are all proper storytelling devices. What I have a problem with is when any of this is done in a careless, haphazard fashion which makes the story look like it doesn't know what it's saying. Regardless of which side of the fence you stand on, that is exactly what happened with this show over time. What did you want? One-dimensional characterizations featuring one-dimensional morality? "Train him in ways to make sure he could harden his heart when getting close to a human woman"? Really? Anyone can become a monster. One doesn't have to be a "demon" or a career criminal to become one. Reality has proven this . . . over and over again. Is it really that bad for a work of fiction to reflect that? Or is it easier to believe that only an "Other" or someone who isn't like "us" should be viewed as irredeemably evil? Nobody said one had to be a member of a "bad species" or a career criminal to be a monster. Not even Charmed itself says so, as the show itself has had a sizable number of bad humans. Tyra Wilson's killer Gibbs, P³ waitress Abbey, "Dream Sorcerer" Whitaker Berman, that mortal at the bar called Jack who Cole sensed had the heart of a killer (not to be confused with Jack Sheridan), and even though he gradually turned to crime and the way the sisters dealt with him was horrible, Phoebe's old high school buddy Rick Gittridge also counts. And I'm pretty sure that's less than half the examples. For a series dealing explicitly with supernatural warfare, that's not a bad turnout. That said, are you honestly telling me you wouldn't be the least bit wary if you discovered that an immortal Superman has been running around as an assassin for over 50 years yet suddenly he/she is disavowing his/her evil ways and professing his/her love to your best friend or sibling after they've known each other for merely two months? Because that's what you're dismissing as no big deal with your condescension, like I'm somehow wrong for thinking that despite my enjoyment of Cole's character, his conversion was somewhat rushed in hindsight and could've been handled with more gravitas (oh, and the maturity level of the person he did it for does affect this). I suggest you read the real definition of warlocks to understand why there can be evil witches without being warlocks. If by "the real definition" you mean "warlocks are male, witches are female", then yes. I'm aware of the real definition. Also, congratulations. You just hit on exactly my problem with the inconsistency of how the "witches and warlocks" paradigm was handled. The show's definition of warlocks was established as "evil witches", which means the terms are separated along morality lines instead of gender lines, yet it hesitates to call any evil female witches warlocks while having no problem calling almost every evil male witch one. It's to the point warlocks are treated as a separate species as if that somehow justifies the discretion, when all that's really behind it is an arbitrary leaning towards keeping the name separated along gender lines despite the change in the canon meaning. Which thus builds in the unfortunate implication that when women go bad they just kinda go bad, and it's always because reasons, you know? It's only the men that truly turn evil and are all about the power.Which THEN creates the excuse, and this is the point I'm ultimately getting at, that since the sisters aren't in any real danger of turning into clear villains by their own actions, THEY, PLUS ANYONE THEY LIKE, ARE FREE TO CROSS THE LINE A HUNDRED TIMES AND ONLY SUFFER CONSEQUENCES FOR IT TEN. The gross mishandling of the show's altered distinction between witches and warlocks is directly tied to the problem with the Charmed Ones that's responsible for this thread. Do you get where I'm coming from now?
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Esmeralda
Charmed
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Post by Esmeralda on Nov 24, 2014 16:19:40 GMT -5
Actually there was *A* female warlock. Jane in "The Painted World" was a female warlock.
Also remember that after Season Two, the word "demon" and "warlock" were pretty interchangeable although originally they were two totally different things. But that's Kern for you...
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ljones
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Post by ljones on Nov 24, 2014 19:03:15 GMT -5
That "real" definition was used by the producer and writers of "BEWITCHED". Basically, a warlock is a witch who has broke his or her oath as a witch. An "oathbreaker".
There is no excuse. The Halliwells do not have any excuses for their crimes anymore than Cole or other such characters on the show did. I don't believe in giving them excuses because they are labeled as "heroines" or the protagonists of the series. That's good, old-fashioned hypocrisy in my eyes.
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Post by Darkhorse Christian on Nov 26, 2014 22:35:21 GMT -5
That "real" definition was used by the producer and writers of "BEWITCHED". Basically, a warlock is a witch who has broke his or her oath as a witch. An "oathbreaker". Ah, thanks for clearing that up. That said, the Wiccan Rede is implied to be the primary oath of witches in the series, so I still disagree with the idea that evil witches and warlocks being different species makes sense within the mythos of Charmed. There is no excuse. The Halliwells do not have any excuses for their crimes anymore than Cole or other such characters on the show did. I don't believe in giving them excuses because they are labeled as "heroines" or the protagonists of the series. That's good, old-fashioned hypocrisy in my eyes. I don't recall saying the excuse was valid. All I'm saying is this is probably how Creative justified it in their heads. Heck, I'm blankly calling it an excuse created by "virtue" of a mishandled concept, which should spell out between the lines that I don't think it's valid. And if anything, the fact that they're supposed to be the heroes makes it even worse. Actually there was *A* female warlock. Jane in "The Painted World" was a female warlock. Also remember that after Season Two, the word "demon" and "warlock" were pretty interchangeable although originally they were two totally different things. But that's Kern for you... Ugh, exactly…
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ljones
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Post by ljones on Nov 28, 2014 3:59:05 GMT -5
This series didn't know jack about "the Wiccan Rede". A witch cannot use his or her ability for personal gain? I've never heard of such a thing about Wiccan practitioners. In fact, I can write an essay criticizing this series' portrayal of magic and Wiccans. If a witch has made an oath to another set of beliefs other than those to Wicca, then yes . . . one can be an evil witch without being a warlock. Prue took the piece of paper because jack took away the client she was talking to so as they say an eye for an eye. And the reason phoebe kill cal is because he kill elise i know it's wrong to kill. Some one should tell cal greene that Are you hinting that Phoebe had the right to kill Cal, because he had killed her friend?
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ljones
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Post by ljones on Nov 28, 2014 4:04:07 GMT -5
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Post by isaiah on Nov 30, 2014 1:24:42 GMT -5
This series didn't know jack about "the Wiccan Rede". A witch cannot use his or her ability for personal gain? I've never heard of such a thing about Wiccan practitioners. In fact, I can write an essay criticizing this series' portrayal of magic and Wiccans. If a witch has made an oath to another set of beliefs other than those to Wicca, then yes . . . one can be an evil witch without being a warlock. Prue took the piece of paper because jack took away the client she was talking to so as they say an eye for an eye. And the reason phoebe kill cal is because he kill elise i know it's wrong to kill. Some one should tell cal greene that Are you hinting that Phoebe had the right to kill Cal, because he had killed her friend? no i said it wrong to kill i also said someone should tell cal that its wrong to kill other people but it doesn't matter because phoebe didn't kill him and he in jail so happy ending
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codebox
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Post by codebox on May 28, 2019 0:40:44 GMT -5
Phoebe driving Cole to insanity then refusing to use the vanquishing potion on a suicidal Cole out of spite- By far one of Phoebe's more sinister deeds. Since Season 3 she caused a cycle of connecting Cole to evil (even when he wasn't directly involved) blaming him for it, then he has to redeem himself rinse/repeat until after the Queen of the Underworld drama. Afterwards Cole loses his sanity and she refuses to vanquish a suicidal Cole out of spite after she'd already caused his situation.
Phoebe choosing to be evil Queen of the Underworld simply because she refused to leave Cole- Think it's well known Phoebe would choose Cole over her sisters, however now she's doing it to becoming an evil ruler of the underworld. A choice she made on her own!
Phoebe & Paige glamoring Rick as Chris to have demons kill him- By far the most infamous and out of character deed. The pretty much ruined their "Charmed One" status for me. The fact they let a moral die and is one of the worst abuses of power on the show. Especially for Paige who, during the season was involved with helping people.
The Charmed One's bartering with the Avatars simply to create their own utopia- The Charmed Ones shouldn't have this much power to basically have higher beings make their own self serving world. Even worse is that they only decide to take everything back by remembering their own losses! To hell with everyone's free will!
Phoebe and Paige killing Daryl during the Valhalley of Downward Spiral- Daryl's their friend right? Since when did they decide killing him and taking his soul away nonconsentually was all of a sudden a good thing? I questioned why Daryl didn't just report them or take action then.
The Charmed Ones constantly hating Leprechauns during Season 8, then using them as canon fodder to scope out demons- Season 8 has the Charmed Ones hate their magical colleagues for some reason. Not only that they abuse their status with them and force them to do their jobs.. In fact I questioned why they even helped them at all later. Aside from Paige occasionally, Phoebe nor Piper had anything to do with them. Then they have the gall to send them out into battle because its "too dangerous for them to go" even though by Season 8 standards the Charmed Ones basically abandoned everyone.
Phoebe turning Spencer Ricks into a turkey and pig out of revenge- Yes Spencer Ricks was a sexist person. However Phoebe just outright abuses him with potions by turning him into animals simply out of distaste for the guy.
The Charmed One's using Billie to do their Job- Season 8 wants us to believe Billie is there doing their job so the Charmed Ones can hide in secret for a cause. Yet they just take advantage of the fact they have another witch that can go demon hunting while Viper and PhoeME just enjoy their day taking about guys or not having to be witches.
Piper not binding Wyatt's powers- This is one of the most confusing things and I still don't understand tbh. Piper never binds Wyatt's powers despite the fact she persists he have a normal life. Not doing this causes Wyatt to summon a dragon that rampages the city potentially killing millions of people, shrinking her and Leo and trapping them in the doll house, Wyatt abusing his powers on Piper's then rebound guys risking magic exposure etc.
The Charmed Ones were willing to let Inspector Sheridan rot in a coma simply because she inconvenienced them- While Sheridan wasn't a good person who was willing to expose them at all cost, even if it meant putting the police department in danger. The fact they were more concerned with her being out of a coma because her memories to expose them were back over the fact she was put into a coma by Kyle simply so he could further his own agenda just cemented how far gone the Charmed Ones were.. Who exactly were the heroes in the later seasons?
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Post by Melinda Halliwell on May 28, 2019 3:53:32 GMT -5
Agree with all codebox and I'm surprised known of the sisters were pulled up on any of them except Phoebe having her powers taken for mistreating her premonitions.
I do wish higher powered beings like the Elders, the Cleaner's, Angel Of Death or Angel Of Destiny had more balls about reigning the girls in and that consequences were shown and meant something like the reboot showed this year then.
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Post by Katie Warren on May 28, 2019 4:37:04 GMT -5
I hate that they forgot the lesson they learned in 'Morality Bites'. Really lost respect for Phoebe, but really this was Kerns fault and the writers forgetting their own canon, and Piper and Phoebe were just shells of their former selves. They were not the Piper and Phoebe I loved in the earlier seasons.
The sisters, or especially Piper and Phoebe would have been so much happier just giving up their powers in 'Witch Way Now', and maybe Paige can just continue to be a witch without the Power of Three.
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codebox
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Post by codebox on May 28, 2019 13:10:18 GMT -5
I hate that they forgot the lesson they learned in 'Morality Bites'. Really lost respect for Phoebe, but really this was Kerns fault and the writers forgetting their own canon, and Piper and Phoebe were just shells of their former selves. They were not the Piper and Phoebe I loved in the earlier seasons. The sisters, or especially Piper and Phoebe would have been so much happier just giving up their powers in 'Witch Way Now', and maybe Paige can just continue to be a witch without the Power of Three. Especially considering the fact Phoebe basically had no powers in Seasons 6 & 8. She was just a mortal who could cast spells but rarely even did that. Even though it was Phoebe's biggest strength in Seasons 1 & 2. Guess she was too self focused she lost her battling prowess. The only thing she'd do in later seasons was occasionally kick a demon, but was even rarely placed in situations where that proved to be just as formidable, outside of that she was mostly useless. Piper or Paige would have to take the offense while Phoebe merely just threw a potion at most or stood there as the other two killed the demon (mostly Piper when Paige would throw a potion over TK orbing) Sure Phoebe was always the least offensive of the sisters, but the early seasons had Phoebe just as formidable with her spell making and martial arts. Especially season 3 where she and Prue were placed in many situations where they proved to be just as useful as having powers. Hence why Piper got a bit of a combat shaft in season 3. I agree Witch Way Now should've been the finale. Or at least the end of Piper and Phoebe having powers.
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codebox
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Post by codebox on May 28, 2019 21:04:15 GMT -5
Agree with all codebox and I'm surprised known of the sisters were pulled up on any of them except Phoebe having her powers taken for mistreating her premonitions. I do wish higher powered beings like the Elders, the Cleaner's, Angel Of Death or Angel Of Destiny had more balls about reigning the girls in and that consequences were shown and meant something like the reboot showed this year then. Piper little less so because aside from freezing people out of annoyance I don't remember what she did that was worth of losing her powers. (She should be outed for her selfishness at the very least) At least at that time. Unless you count not binding Wyatt's powers as worthy of the same punishment. Paige is debatable. One one hand, Her actions for Rick, Daryl, Mr Right (twice) and glamor abuse deserve some amount of punishment. On the other hand she does spend the season with actual concern for helping innocent people, regularly or magically. It made the most sense to take Phoebe's away since she didn't really have much of a counter and had the most accounts of power abuse against her. The closest one to punish them was the Angel of Destiny from Season 8. Her taking Leo away felt like a punishment imo. Or at least a realization on her part. The rest I agree with though.
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Post by Katie Warren on May 29, 2019 0:26:05 GMT -5
I hate that they forgot the lesson they learned in 'Morality Bites'. Really lost respect for Phoebe, but really this was Kerns fault and the writers forgetting their own canon, and Piper and Phoebe were just shells of their former selves. They were not the Piper and Phoebe I loved in the earlier seasons. The sisters, or especially Piper and Phoebe would have been so much happier just giving up their powers in 'Witch Way Now', and maybe Paige can just continue to be a witch without the Power of Three. Especially considering the fact Phoebe basically had no powers in Seasons 6 & 8. She was just a mortal who could cast spells but rarely even did that. Even though it was Phoebe's biggest strength in Seasons 1 & 2. Guess she was too self focused she lost her battling prowess. The only thing she'd do in later seasons was occasionally kick a demon, but was even rarely placed in situations where that proved to be just as formidable, outside of that she was mostly useless. Piper or Paige would have to take the offense while Phoebe merely just threw a potion at most or stood there as the other two killed the demon (mostly Piper when Paige would throw a potion over TK orbing) Sure Phoebe was always the least offensive of the sisters, but the early seasons had Phoebe just as formidable with her spell making and martial arts. Especially season 3 where she and Prue were placed in many situations where they proved to be just as useful as having powers. Hence why Piper got a bit of a combat shaft in season 3. I agree Witch Way Now should've been the finale. Or at least the end of Piper and Phoebe having powers. That's true, Phoebe really did help with her spells and martial arts in the early seasons, and her premonitions were always just as important in saving innocents. I never saw her power as least important, it was important many times. This was lost later on. Phoebe was hardly useless in S1 and S2. Makes me appreciate the earlier seasons. When later Piper (with her exploding power) just did all the work, with Paige as a backup, and yeah Phoebe threw the potion. I think they got it right with the original powers and how they defined the sisters and their powers. I think the characters would be so much happier if that happened in Witch Way Now. I would have liked that ending, and didn't like that they had to make a decision and agree majority rules.
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