Aaeiyn
Elder
✨The Amazing Phoebe✨
Posts: 5,554
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Post by Aaeiyn on Sept 15, 2023 17:27:36 GMT -5
This is a continuation from the Favorite S4 Sister(s) thread. Max of up to TWO votes!Don't forget to vote in other threads! |
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Aaeiyn
Elder
✨The Amazing Phoebe✨
Posts: 5,554
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Post by Aaeiyn on Sept 15, 2023 17:28:47 GMT -5
I swear I still like Phoebe LOL
I understand how S5A Phoebe feels, but it's still hard to watch.
So, Paige & Piper, it is!
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Post by greta on Sept 15, 2023 17:48:06 GMT -5
Piper and Paige.
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Esmeralda
Charmed
S2 "What If...?"
Fan Fic Winner
Twenty Years Gone....But Never Forgotten.
Posts: 21,920 
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Post by Esmeralda on Sept 16, 2023 17:09:49 GMT -5
Just Piper - but not counting 'Oh, My Goddess!' which I count as part of S6 where I don't like any of the sisters.
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wiccawonder
Innocent
Currently rewatching S2-S3!
Posts: 88
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Post by wiccawonder on Dec 22, 2023 3:41:14 GMT -5
Piper and Paige for me!
In this season, we really see Paige grow as a witch once she moves past her inferiority complex in regards to Prue and really grows.
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Post by prueislove on Nov 21, 2024 3:36:20 GMT -5
Piper and Phoebe for me. Phoebe was my favourite because she treated Cole exactly like he deserved.
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Aaeiyn
Elder
✨The Amazing Phoebe✨
Posts: 5,554
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Post by Aaeiyn on Nov 21, 2024 12:48:10 GMT -5
Phoebe was my favourite because she treated Cole exactly like he deserved. That's what makes S5 one of my least favorite seasons. He didn't deserve, any of that. The Charmed Ones should've helped him, in the proper way that they should've. Paige had the right idea in S5E7 "Sympathy for the Demon". When, that didn't work, moved onto plan B, like she did in S5E12 "Centennial Charmed". IK she was (also) trying to work on a protection spell/potion for Phoebe back in S5E3 "Happily Ever After". I just wished they didn't just say "oh well, not our problem". And, Phoebe irritated me to the point that I'm glad Paige called her out in S5E1 "A Witch's Tail, Pt 1", that Phoebe was more concerned in pushing her divorce through rather than trying to help Miley. But, I digress.
All this could've been avoided, had Cole stayed dead back in S4E20 "Long Live the Queen". I STILL hate his return, to this day! And, if the show MUST keep him alive, he should've left town, after he rescued Phoebe from being a mermaid, like he was gonna do in S5E2 "A Witch's Tail, Pt 2". The S5E3 "Happily Ever After" ending gave me so much hope before S5E4 "Siren Song" just threw it all away.
On top of that, I think Cole DOES have a good side. Barbas wouldn't have been able tap into Cole's fears of "being evil", if that fear wasn't already there/present within Cole, in the first place, in S5E7 "Sympathy for the Demon". Barbas doesn't "create fear"; he enhances it. And, Cole's first instinct, in S4E10 "A Paige from the Past" beginning was to help the people in the car. And, his aggression towards the Slumlords for hurting their tenants in BOTH S4E12 "Lost & Bound" and S5E5 "Witches in Tights" is (also) telling. And, an early sign of it is actually in S3E4 "All Halliwell's Eve", when he told the Grimlocks to let the boy go. They should've helped him how to do good for the sake of it (which a small bit of it was there) rather than "for Phoebe". He just got hit with depression SO bad, that he lost it, in S5E9 "Sam I am" and continued spiraling out of control. Again, they should've helped him, more than they did. This is just early signs of their downfall, that Christy calls out, in late S8, but I digress.
This isn't to say Phoebe MUST be with Cole. No, he should've left her the hell alone, like she asked (the same way Leo should've, towards Piper back in S2, but I digress). Phoebe does NOT owe Cole a relationship. He just should've found his own identity, that wasn't "all about Phoebe" but to do good rather than evil. Even Prue notices Cole's change and even refers to him as an "innocent" in S3E16 "Death Takes a Halliwell". |
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Post by prueislove on Nov 22, 2024 22:12:01 GMT -5
Haha the only reason I like Phoebe was because she stood up to her abuser in this season and that's not easy when your trust in a person has been shattered multiple times. She reacted the same way in Look Who's Barking and Cole hadn't even done much than kill a witch and slightly betray her trust.
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Aaeiyn
Elder
✨The Amazing Phoebe✨
Posts: 5,554
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Post by Aaeiyn on Nov 22, 2024 22:46:41 GMT -5
Haha the only reason I like Phoebe was because she stood up to her abuser in this season and that's not easy when your trust in a person has been shattered multiple times. She reacted the same way in Look Who's Barking and Cole hadn't even done much than kill a witch and slightly betray her trust. And, yet, towards the end of S3E21 "Look who's Barking" she wanted to help save/rescue him. Again, I'm not saying Phoebe & Cole should be in a relationship (though, I do ship them, but that's beside's the point) but just help Cole become a better person even without Phoebe. This stuff doesn't happen overnight, and we can get into the depths of what occurred during the time of his reign as "the Source" whether it was really him or possession in the respective thread via What Cole did as the Source *was* his own fault thread. Cole has been regarded as an "innocent" in a few episodes via S3E16 "Death Takes a Halliwell", S4E8 "Black as Cole" (ending), S5E7 "Sympathy for the Demon", etc. S5 just didn't do a good job helping someone who needed help, and I blame the writers (mostly Kern) for bringing him back, when he didn't need to be returned. |
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Post by prueislove on Nov 23, 2024 0:37:54 GMT -5
My point is Cole had hurt Phoebe more than enough. Her reaction was justified. Any abuse victim would respond in the same way.
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Aaeiyn
Elder
✨The Amazing Phoebe✨
Posts: 5,554
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Post by Aaeiyn on Nov 23, 2024 2:22:33 GMT -5
My point is Cole had hurt Phoebe more than enough. Her reaction was justified. Any abuse victim would respond in the same way. Absolutely, after going through something similarly (but not quite) as Phoebe did, I understand why she acted the way she did. However, he needs help just as much as she does. And, IK some (not all) S2E2 "Morality Bites" fans like to hold our leading ladies to a much higher standard in handling situations like these. Regardless of how Phoebe feels, she still has a duty to uphold and probably should've helped Cole not by being in a relationship with him but helping him find his own identity outside of her and the Underworld. Along with her sisters. I can relate to being held to a "higher standard", as that's what my faith teaches me, but as Charmed progresses into the later seasons, it continues to drive further and further away from pretending to be some "Christian" show despite containing witches. I'm more about what the entertainment's message is rather than the surface level stuff like the main leads are witches. Which the show does a TERRIBLE job in representing them as such. Especially by the later seasons, it felt more like superheroes, but I digress. |
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Post by prueislove on Nov 23, 2024 2:26:44 GMT -5
Well, abusers do tend to need help. My ex did as well but that doesn't make what they did right. And they didn't punish Cole, he wouldn't leave them alone. He couldn't take no for an answer. And that is wrong too.
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Aaeiyn
Elder
✨The Amazing Phoebe✨
Posts: 5,554
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Post by Aaeiyn on Nov 23, 2024 2:30:00 GMT -5
Well, abusers do tend to need help. My ex did as well but that doesn't make what they did right. And they didn't punish Cole, he wouldn't leave them alone. He couldn't take no for an answer. And that is wrong too. I agree he wouldn't leave them alone, that's just the fault of bad S5A writing because I think he was fine from S5E3 "Happily Ever After" - S5E8 "Witch in Time". It wasn't until S5E9 "Sam I am" I feel, that he lost his mind. That's what I mean, nobody was trying to help him PRIOR to S5E9 "Sam I Am". Darryl kind of did back in S5E2 "A Witch's Tail, Pt 2" & Paige in S5E7 "Sympathy for the Demon", but that's about it. This is why he should've NEVER been resurrected or (at least) left by AFTER rescuing Mermaid Phoebe, at the end of S5E2 "A Witch's Tail, Pt 2", like he was going to do, if Kern ('cause he's responsible for bringing him back in S4E22 "Witch Way, Now?") really wanted him alive. |
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Post by prueislove on Nov 23, 2024 2:35:09 GMT -5
Actually its abuser mentality, they can't accept that they've lost the person they were controlling.
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Aaeiyn
Elder
✨The Amazing Phoebe✨
Posts: 5,554
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Post by Aaeiyn on Nov 23, 2024 2:39:13 GMT -5
Actually its abuser mentality, they can't accept that they've lost the person they were controlling. Which is why he needed help, to live a life without clinging onto Phoebe/Underworld. Sorry, perhaps, it's my faith projecting out because no one is too far gone to be saved, and if we're holding the Charmed Ones to a "higher standard" like Christians, I'm not going to just toss Cole to the side, like a piece of trash and let him rot. I'm gonna do what I can to help save him. |
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Post by prueislove on Nov 23, 2024 2:42:32 GMT -5
My faith also supports redemption so I understand you a lot in that respect. However, we do believe in good & evil. Sometimes people make the decision not to change. We believe in forgiveness but we also believe evil exists.
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Aaeiyn
Elder
✨The Amazing Phoebe✨
Posts: 5,554
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Post by Aaeiyn on Nov 23, 2024 2:49:22 GMT -5
My faith also supports redemption so I understand you a lot in that respect. However, we do believe in good & evil. Sometimes people make the decision not to change. We believe in forgiveness but we also believe evil exists. Yes, my faith does this as well, and I do think Cole wanted to change just didn't know how / reach that comfortably level, yet. It takes time, and I don't think the Charmed Ones appropriately treated him, the way he should've been treated. Cole needed therapy, TBH. |
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Post by prueislove on Nov 23, 2024 2:59:14 GMT -5
Phoebe needed more therapy and seeing her abuser probably didn't help her heal from that. Notice the difference between later s4 and s5 Phoebe compared to s8 Phoebe who was scared of finding love and had a closed heart again. S2 Cupid helped Phoebe open her heart and she found Cole. After Cole hurt her, she became pre-s1 Phoebe and kept dating and dating but closed her heart off again to what had happened.
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Aaeiyn
Elder
✨The Amazing Phoebe✨
Posts: 5,554
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Post by Aaeiyn on Nov 23, 2024 3:09:00 GMT -5
Phoebe needed more therapy and seeing her abuser probably didn't help her heal from that. Notice the difference between later s4 and s5 Phoebe compared to s8 Phoebe who was scared of finding love and had a closed heart again. S2 Cupid helped Phoebe open her heart and she found Cole. After Cole hurt her, she became pre-s1 Phoebe and kept dating and dating but closed her heart off again to what had happened. It's not a competition, they both needed help. Once again, some (not all) hold the Charmed Ones to a higher standard, and (at the very least) Paige & Piper should've helped Cole out, if we really need Phoebe separate from Cole, until she's ready to face him, again and do her duty, as a Charmed One. I'd have a "closed off heart", too if my sisters kept stealing my LI, looking at you Piper! I noticed the difference as soon as S5b started. S5b-S8 is the same Phoebe, to me. |
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Post by prueislove on Nov 23, 2024 3:30:25 GMT -5
I respect that but respectfully disagree because Phoebe deserved better than Cole. He took away her love for magic and I will never forgive him for that.
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