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Post by marienomad on Oct 20, 2007 9:52:09 GMT -5
I am a little confused about the deal the Charmed Ones made with that demon in Kill Billie vol 2. What happened and what's the deal?
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Post by whitelightertony on Oct 20, 2007 16:52:44 GMT -5
The younger generations of demons would support the Charmed Ones in going after Billie and Christy, and in turn, the demons would wait several decades before coming after the Charmed Ones' offspring.
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Post by marienomad on Oct 21, 2007 9:22:53 GMT -5
Would these demons still attack innocents?
And if they do, would the Charmed Ones stand by letting the demons attack so that their kids would be safe?
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Post by whitelightertony on Oct 21, 2007 16:05:25 GMT -5
Yes, to the first question; no, to the second.
Innocents would still be fair game for the demons. And the Charmed Ones could still protect and defend Innocents.
The younger generations of demons just had an understanding that the wouldn't go after the Halliwell family for several decades at least.
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Post by ShantaD on Oct 21, 2007 20:02:01 GMT -5
. The younger generations of demons just had an understanding that the wouldn't go after the Halliwell family for several decades at least. I don't remember that. I thought the younger demons said that they realized they weren't powerful enough to go after the Charmed Ones. So they would work with the Charmed Ones to defeat the sisters only remaining threat because they were also a threat to the less powerful demons and were preventing them from growing in power and becoming upper level demons. I don't think the Charmed Ones children are getting any free pass once those demons acquire more power. |
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Post by whitelightertony on Oct 21, 2007 22:23:40 GMT -5
But it will probably take those demons several decades to build up more power.
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xxjaapxx
Innocent
Without evil there is no good, Without good there is no evil. Be like an avatar
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Post by xxjaapxx on Oct 22, 2007 9:53:32 GMT -5
that is what they sayed:"we will wait attacking for some years, and maybe untill the next generation is on"
or something like that
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ljones
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Post by ljones on Oct 22, 2007 10:47:13 GMT -5
Was the show trying to hint that the Charmed Ones had killed all of the older demons? Wow! Talk about a fantasy trip!
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Post by vandergraafk on Oct 22, 2007 19:30:15 GMT -5
Well, no, I don't think we can assume that. After all, Barbas was certainly not vanquished. Worse: resurrecting the TRIAD made the whole demonic Underworld even more chaotic than before. If the Source were the source of all evil, why should the TRIAD be the ultimate threat? Unless we understand ultimate in its original sense as the "final" battle, then we become thoroughly confused.
And who knows what other demons were imprisoned still in the Source's dungeon. I assume that this place was carefully protected so that not even the Avatars could sense who was there and might still pose a threat. After all, they could only out demons they knew about!
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Post by whitelightertony on Oct 23, 2007 2:29:59 GMT -5
The writers were probably hinting that the older demons simply no longer had an ironclad lock on the power hierarchy of Evil.
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Post by vandergraafk on Oct 23, 2007 10:24:28 GMT -5
That's quite possible. There was no successor to the Source, i.e., the Seer. And, it may not have been in the interest of the TRIAD to encourage an aspirant to the demonic throne. Perhaps they hoped to thwart lesser demons from ascending to the throne and as such stood in their way. Hence, the complaint of the demon in Kill Billie, Volume 2, who proclaimed the need to push the TRIAD aside.
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ljones
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Post by ljones on Oct 23, 2007 12:03:42 GMT -5
I guess I have always found the idea of a demon being the source of all evil to be a little unbelievable . . . even for a fantasy story.
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Post by vandergraafk on Oct 23, 2007 17:28:40 GMT -5
Suppose it is correct, as Piper surmised in Something Wiccan, that your side "evil" prefer disorder and chaos, as opposed to a structured hierarchy. Then, the Source - and the demonic throne he occupied - represent an effort by those loyal to him to impose an order amid this chaos. Of course, we know that his authority was never complete. The vampires were not included. Indeed, they were told to stay away. The TRIAD apparently were not loyal to the Source and merely represented an unconquerable, unvanquishable power group within the underworld, a group who had their own agenda that predated even the Source's attempt to wipe out the Charmed Ones. The TRIAD were not a rival to the Source. They simply chose not to interfere with him.
As a result, it is hubris to assert that he was the Source of All Evil. A vanquish of the Source would then have eliminated all evil. Rather, I take this to mean simply a title or an office from which emanated great power. Lesser demons traced their authority to this source and not, say, to the TRIAD.
The problem, it seems to me, stems from Apocalypse Not. Leo indicates that his bosses talk to their bosses and the problem, the missing Prue and War, needed to be resolved. The Source may have been responsible for the apocalyptos. He was not, however, responsible for solving the problem posed by Prue and War. There probably was a greater demonic council that suggested that the Source put a cork on this attempt at apocalypse.
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Post by whitelightertony on Oct 24, 2007 0:25:08 GMT -5
By his title, The Source of All Evil, I read that to mean that The Source was the most powerful creature of Evil in the universe at that point in time...just like the Charmed Ones were the most powerful form of Good in the universe.
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ljones
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Post by ljones on Oct 24, 2007 1:10:06 GMT -5
I thought they were only supposed to be the most powerful witches. How did they come to being the most powerful form of Good?  |
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Post by MarAcev on Oct 24, 2007 17:23:55 GMT -5
Because they were fighting for the side of good and nobody else more powerful than them was doing it? Hence they became the greatest force of good.
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Post by vandergraafk on Oct 25, 2007 17:45:51 GMT -5
I don't know whether I can even buy into the Source as the most powerful evil of that particular time. I might if I knew more about the demonic underworld. Certainly, the TRIAD were no match for the Source. Hence, they steered clear of him. Zankou probably wasn't either, but he might have challenged him. And, as for the Charmed Ones, they are only as good as their actions. Intentions count, but we've all witnessed what came of their good intentions during the Avatar saga! Yes, they are a powerful force. And, yes they may have done a whole lot of good. But, could they, should they, be just given a blank check? Wasn't that the whole point of Dumain's duplicity with respect to Billie? He was trying to convince her that even though the Charmed Ones had served the greater good, they might not always and would have to be stopped now before they had become power hungry and presumably unstoppable. To put it bluntly: You're only as good as your last vanquish! |
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Post by whitelightertony on Oct 27, 2007 5:05:21 GMT -5
But the point is, had the Charmed Ones always put aside their selfishness and misplaced motives, they would have been the strongest force of Good in the universe.
And if The Source wasn't the most powerful form of Evil during his lifetime, and there was a more powerful being out there representing Evil, then why did the characters never talk about that being?
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Post by vandergraafk on Oct 29, 2007 18:05:16 GMT -5
I think it can be inferred that the Source was probably the most powerful demonic force of his time, but he was a bit hot-headed as well. The problem is with the title "Source of All Evil". One way to read that is to see the Source as the wellspring of all evil: the devil incarnate, if you will. Clearly, he was not that. He may well have been "primus unter pares": first among equals or perhaps just slightly more powerful: who knows? The fact that Cole alludes to the battle that both disfigured the Source and brought him to power suggests the sort of "political" jousting that led to the emergence of a powerful prime ministerial position in England (the Elder and Younger Pitts, for example). This also occurred at a time when the kings were dim-witted (George I through George III). I just wish we knew a lot more about the demonic underworld. Instead, we capture only kaleidoscopic images.
The Source as Oliver Cromwell?
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ljones
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Post by ljones on Oct 29, 2007 20:19:43 GMT -5
Because they were fighting for the side of good and nobody else more powerful than them was doing it? Hence they became the greatest force of good. Hence, I really don't buy this stuff. There are other demon hunters, witches, etc. throughout the world and the Charmed Ones are the only ones that get this moniker? Yeah right. In other words, they would have never become the so-called "strongest force of Good", since they have never been able to truly overcome their darker impulses. And I doubt that they ever will. |
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