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Post by foxfire on Jan 10, 2008 18:24:31 GMT -5
Jason should have known earlier. She was really serious with him and the way he found out was just all wrong. I agree with Esmeralda that there's a large problem when one of the sisters tells the boyfriend in the wrong way.
Jason shouldn't have had to see her orb in. That was probably what made him freak-out. Although, he clearly couldn't handle it. Seeing as the two parted ways at the end of the episode. I am however peeved that Phoebe told Dex. Dex should have NEVER known about her being a witch. They dated for all of what... a month or two?! On top of that, she didn't even love him!! That Phoebe... girl never learns.
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Post by vandergraafk on Jan 10, 2008 18:26:01 GMT -5
Ljones, I guess that one consequence of the anarchy that currently rages in the Charmed Cafe. We've got multiple, overlapping threads. We've got new ones popping up all the time that duplicate existing ones. As a long-time poster, I am equally frustrated when an issue arises that has been discussed elsewhere. Worse: new participants seem disinclined to seek out the old ones to see what was already discussed. Hang in there. It could be worse. What if we forgot where we had already posted something? Oh wait! I've already done that. Now where did I write this already.
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colehellsangel
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Post by colehellsangel on Jan 10, 2008 20:39:27 GMT -5
Jason should have known earlier. She was really serious with him and the way he found out was just all wrong. I agree with Esmeralda that there's a large problem when one of the sisters tells the boyfriend in the wrong way. Jason shouldn't have had to see her orb in. That was probably what made him freak-out. Although, he clearly couldn't handle it. Seeing as the two parted ways at the end of the episode. I am however peeved that Phoebe told Dex. Dex should have NEVER known about her being a witch. They dated for all of what... a month or two?! On top of that, she didn't even love him!! That Phoebe... girl never learns. Yes I agree Jason should have known the way Henry found out from Paige(Which I have not actually seen but people here seem to approve of it and I guess he did not take it badly). She even moved in with Jason for pity's sake. I think the person she lives with needs to know. I also agree with Esmeralda about the way the boyfriends are told just that its not an easy thing to tell someone so they can't be fully blamed is all.
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spiritsas
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Post by spiritsas on Jan 10, 2008 22:10:18 GMT -5
Two things strike me about this thread. I hadn't read all the posts but the same thought dawned on me as did, ina, a newbie innocent to the site, who notes that Elise ran a newspaper and was a professional in her field. How could they tell such a person their secret and expect her to keep the biggest story of her life under wraps. Second thing that struck me was that it seems to have gone off on a tangent about the boy friends and who else should have been told. Dan is brought up. Actually, he was told, but the memory was removed by the Genie who caused the wish to turn on Dan and make him grow old, suddenly.
It's also worth noting, to add to this tangent, that not every male in a romantic relationship with one of the sisters was told. Obviously, anyone who was going to marry a CO would have to be told, but "what's his name" from the first couple of seasons (Prue partner at the auction house) was never told and he was unceremoniously dumped. Fireman Tom or whatever his name was, was never told by Piper. In fact, the only boyfriends, who then didn't marry a CO who were told, all belonged to Phoebe. Paige's friend (from her past) doesn't count here as they were not romantically involved during the show (well, there was a short encounter during his first visit, OK, but they were not dating or anything). Just thought I'd throw that one out there.
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ljones
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Post by ljones on Jan 10, 2008 23:07:42 GMT -5
Sounds like typical Phoebe trying to dismiss Dan so that Piper can have an easier choice. Like her idiotic reason for losing the child she was carrying in late S4.
Piper never struck me as the type who would date a guy for half a year merely because she felt lust for him. In fact, Dan's personality strongly reminds me of Leo. Which is why I'm not surprised that she became serious with him. Even though she loved Dan, she loved Leo more. That's it.
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Esmeralda
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Post by Esmeralda on Jan 11, 2008 7:33:24 GMT -5
Sounds like typical Phoebe trying to dismiss Dan so that Piper can have an easier choice. Like her idiotic reason for losing the child she was carrying in late S4. Piper never struck me as the type who would date a guy for half a year merely because she felt lust for him. In fact, Dan's personality strongly reminds me of Leo. Which is why I'm not surprised that she became serious with him. Even though she loved Dan, she loved Leo more. That's it. I'll agree. The sisters were very good at rationalizing bad decisions. I wish I could say that I thought that Piper loved Dan more than Leo. I don't think she ever loved Dan, period. She was in love with what he represented--the normal life that Leo couldn't give her--that's why she rebounded onto him--and the reason why she didn't tell him the secret--if he knew, then he'd be part of the life she didn't want to have--the life of a witch. But until when/if she truly wanted that enough to give up her powers, she *was* a witch and shouldn't have slept with him until she 1)accepted the fact that she was a witch and told him or 2)gave up her powers and wouldn't have to tell him. Since, thanks to her sisters, she couldn't/wouldn't do that, she truly should not have slept with Dan since she was truly simply using him, which was terribly unfair to him and explains why he acted like such a jerk in the latter part of S2. And Piper never learned her lesson, since she acted the same way with Greg the Fireman for a worse reason--pure lust. Which brings us to Phoebe. Of all the sisters, she handled her relationships the worst, the reason so many fans call her a sl*t and her guys her slampieces. She was the ultimate user. When it came to guys, she seemed to be in a fantasy world, not accepting reality, which is amazing after what she went through with Cole. She truly should've been given a very, VERY huge reality check--real life just doesn't work like that. It's why I wish *she* was the one who ended up with a true non-magical handyman. For those who watched the show "Cheers!", Phoebe always reminded me a lot of Rebecca and I would've liked her ending to be more like Rebecca's--Rebecca always wanted to marry someone rich who could take care of her and ended up with a plumber, someone she truly loved and who truly loved her despite neither being rich. Rebecca had her realtiy check--Phoebe desperately needed one and Coop wasn't it, since he was the biggest fantasy of all--a *cupid* in love with her and married by the Angel of Destiny. I'm sure that couple didn't last far beyond her finally getting those three daughters--the reason why we never saw what happened after she had that third daughter, since having her daughters was the only thing she really wanted. If she continued her fantasy world, I'm sure she beat Grams for number of divorces and probably had a dozen kids, all of whom she ignored as she went on to her next fantasy guy. Getting back to the original topic. Maybe that's why Phoebe was able to get away with not telling her secret to Elise and get away with such a flimsy excuse so often and still keep her job. Kern let Phoebe live in a fantasy world where you can get away with such stuff--Phoebe's entire life (like Charmed itself) was truly just someone's (probably Piper's) dream and she should wake up at any time and find out that none of it happened, ESPECIALLY the last three seasons, and ESPECIALLY ESPECIALLY the last season and ESPECIALLY ESPECIALLY ESPECIALLY Forever Charmed!
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spiritsas
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Post by spiritsas on Jan 11, 2008 12:49:52 GMT -5
E: In a real world situation, I couldn't agree with you more about Phoebe. I'm not sure about the last part that she would dump Cupid and keep moving on from guy to guy. That's not the impression left by Forever Charmed, but it doesn't matte.
Of course, since it was a show and Alyssa M. is supposed to be the hot, shapely sex symbol (and I'm not that HMC or RM are not hot, but AM is the one who lists on Maxim and other similar mags as one of the top 100 hottest women). So, it's logical they kept her doing the more sexy relationships with a constant series of hunky guys, like Jason, Dex, Leslie, etc. Her character, in making fun of herself, even stated in one episode that she felt pathetic or sad that, up until that point, her best relationship had been with a demon (Cole, of course). My point is that you have to blame either Kern or the studio in that AM got tagged to be the more sexually active sister, always looking for love and not finding it. But having a good time trying.
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Esmeralda
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Post by Esmeralda on Jan 11, 2008 13:11:10 GMT -5
E: In a real world situation, I couldn't agree with you more about Phoebe. I'm not sure about the last part that she would dump Cupid and keep moving on from guy to guy. That's not the impression left by Forever Charmed, but it doesn't matte. That's the impression left AT THE TIME THAT SHE WAS GOING INTO LABOR WITH HER THIRD CHILD! We never were told what happened after that and since we WERE shown what happened to Leo and Piper, I always took that to mean that the "problems and sorrows" that Piper mentions has to do with stuff happening to the other two couples--the only ones who were "Forever Charmed" were Leo & Piper--the reason I think the whole thing is Piper's fantasy after she and the other two were blown up at the end of Kill Billie, Vol 2, since there's no possible way that Piper could've survived that without a single injury when Paige (who should've panic-orbed) didn't. I'd agree with you IF at the end she was given a more realisitic husband or didn't have that "where I am, he is" crap to try to fill in a horrible plothole!
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charmedfan4evr
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Post by charmedfan4evr on Jan 11, 2008 13:18:11 GMT -5
E: In a real world situation, I couldn't agree with you more about Phoebe. I'm not sure about the last part that she would dump Cupid and keep moving on from guy to guy. That's not the impression left by Forever Charmed, but it doesn't matte. That's the impression left AT THE TIME THAT SHE WAS GOING INTO LABOR WITH HER THIRD CHILD! We never were told what happened after that and since we WERE shown what happened to Leo and Piper, I always took that to mean that the "problems and sorrows" that Piper mentions has to do with stuff happening to the other two couples--the only ones who were "Forever Charmed" were Leo & Piper See this is just one reason why I hated that the show ended in the future. HOW DO YOU KNOW? How do you know that that will actually be their futures? In the world of Charmed, you have no idea! Their future's could most certainly be changed. Which has been clearly evident throughout the series! It just left us to a more unanswered, and unsatisfying end.
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Esmeralda
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Post by Esmeralda on Jan 11, 2008 14:59:20 GMT -5
That's the impression left AT THE TIME THAT SHE WAS GOING INTO LABOR WITH HER THIRD CHILD! We never were told what happened after that and since we WERE shown what happened to Leo and Piper, I always took that to mean that the "problems and sorrows" that Piper mentions has to do with stuff happening to the other two couples--the only ones who were "Forever Charmed" were Leo & Piper HOW DO YOU KNOW? How do you know that that will actually be their futures? In the world of Charmed, you have no idea! Their future's could most certainly be changed. Which has been clearly evident throughout the series! See this is just one reason why I hated that the show ended in the future. It just left us to a more unanswered, and unsatisfying end. Exactly. Something like three sisters standing in the doorway and the breeze would've made so much more sense! Either that or show Phoebe and Coop telling the story to *their* grandkids, and then Paige and Henry telling *theirs* and finally Piper and Leo telling *theirs*, so we'd know that all three couples made it. Having the three of them write stuff down when they hadn't even lived it yet made no sense whatsoever! I still like my ending from my own Charmed Forever best: That's how *I* would've liked to have seen it end. And for any part that doesn't make sense--you'll have to read my fic!
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colehellsangel
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Post by colehellsangel on Jan 11, 2008 15:44:02 GMT -5
All I have to say about this is that I could not agree more.
Umm but wasn't that the real future? Or was it a Morality Bites kind of thing? I am confused as I have only seen the end scene.
Umm its was a demon child, it was turning her evil! and it was not even hers it was the seer's.
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ljones
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Post by ljones on Jan 11, 2008 16:33:46 GMT -5
How could that baby have been the Source's? Even though the Source had possession of Cole's body at the time of the baby's conception, it was Cole's sperm that helped conceived the child. Cole's body. All the Seer did was ensure that Phoebe would get pregnant . . . with the Source using Cole's body. But that baby was Phoebe and Cole's. To insinuate that the baby belonged to the Source only tells me that the writers knew crap about biology. How could it have biologically belonged to the Source's? Technically, he no longer had a sentient body. He was using Cole's. Which means that he was using Cole's seed to impregnate Phoebe:
The only way the Seer and the Source could ensure that the child would be his was for him to marry Phoebe in a dark ceremony and use a tonic that would allow the baby's darker nature to dominate.
If the sisters had been able to use a potion to counter that tonic, chances are that Phoebe and Cole's baby could have lived up to the Seer's original vision.
You know, that sounds like Phoebe and her fairy tale longings.
I believe that she did love Dan. But I don't think that she was in love with him in the way she was in love with Leo. Although if I had my way, she would have ended up with Mark Cho from "Dead Man Dating".
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Post by charmedfan4evr on Jan 11, 2008 16:45:11 GMT -5
Umm but wasn't that the real future? Or was it a Morality Bites kind of thing? I am confused as I have only seen the end scene. Who knows if it was. That's my whole point, we don't! No one can for sure. In the reality of Charmed, do I really think that's what their future holds in store, that exact? No, I don't think so.
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Post by Assassin Witch on Jan 11, 2008 16:49:20 GMT -5
Umm but wasn't that the real future? Or was it a Morality Bites kind of thing? I am confused as I have only seen the end scene. It's unknown. Because we've learned from Charmed that every decision/action we make changes the future. They wanted a "and they all lived happily ever after ending", but Charmed doesn't work like that. There are plenty of us who see passed it and are not afraid to call Kern out on his BS. I for one totally erase the future scene from memory. Well, actually, I stop thinking about Charmed after Chris was born, but whatever.
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colehellsangel
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Post by colehellsangel on Jan 11, 2008 19:41:21 GMT -5
Umm but wasn't that the real future? Or was it a Morality Bites kind of thing? I am confused as I have only seen the end scene. It's unknown. Because we've learned from Charmed that every decision/action we make changes the future. They wanted a "and they all lived happily ever after ending", but Charmed doesn't work like that. There are plenty of us who see passed it and are not afraid to call Kern out on his BS. I for one totally erase the future scene from memory. Well, actually, I stop thinking about Charmed after Chris was born, but whatever. Ok I see. It was nice to see Piper and Leo grow old together but I can see that being a very depressing ending in the sense that being old means the true end. That end may not come right away of course but you go to sleep every night wondering if you will wake up the next morning. And live only to wonder how long you have left(not in an obsessive way though as that only helps it come faster). So in that sense having in end with the charmed ones growing old is certainly a depressing ending. However it ended for me anyway when the Wyatt's Future and Avatar things came into play with a few episodes during those eras here and there that I enjoyed such as Witchstock. I never even bothered to see season eight at first it was no intentional as my mom had been taping them from TNT and it had went back to season one after season seven ended. But after reading things and seeing one or two episodes I really don't like the ideas of season eight. The Charmed ones hiding under fake identities because they are supposed to be dead and more the whole billie thing. I think for a lot of us it was already long over before the finale as it really went downhill in some certain area. For me it was after Cole was permanently vanquished.
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Post by charmedfan4evr on Jan 13, 2008 0:49:20 GMT -5
It's unknown. Because we've learned from Charmed that every decision/action we make changes the future. They wanted a "and they all lived happily ever after ending", but Charmed doesn't work like that. There are plenty of us who see passed it and are not afraid to call Kern out on his BS. Exactly right. I for one totally erase the future scene from memory. So do I, there's no point to it. It wasn't set in stone. with a few episodes during those eras here and there that I enjoyed such as WitchstockI was never a fan of "Witchstock." I actually just watched it yesterday (it was up next on my DVD's), and noticed a blooper. When the warlock freezes the room for the second time, you can clearly see Piper blink.
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colehellsangel
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Post by colehellsangel on Jan 13, 2008 2:21:23 GMT -5
No kidding? I actually just finished watching it on Veohtv and I did not notice that. I will have to open my eyes more next time. I love it its one of my favorite eps. Any particular reasons you don't like it? Just curious not attacking here I am no demon despite my username lol.
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Post by charmedfan4evr on Jan 13, 2008 11:19:00 GMT -5
No kidding? I actually just finished watching it on Veohtv and I did not notice that. I will have to open my eyes more next time. I love it its one of my favorite eps. Any particular reasons you don't like it? Just curious not attacking here I am no demon despite my username lol. You should definitely check it out. I re-winded it twice to make sure, and you can clearly see her blink. I thought the episode was just, I don't know a better way to put it but weird. It was another one of those "happy go lucky" episodes of S6,which I don't like. Plus..so did Grams and Leo always know about Paige? But certainly Grams because she saw all three CO's in the 60's, who admitted that they were her grand-daughters. It was strange.
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colehellsangel
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Post by colehellsangel on Jan 13, 2008 16:23:32 GMT -5
Well Grams at the end when it was time for the girls traveled back to the future said that she wanted to brew a forgetting potion for herself. As for Leo I guess its hard to say although he did remember their meeting since Paige decided to play with him a little and call him 'sungod' as he introduced himself as in 1967. But I doubt any connection was made by the Charmed Again Leo. '67 Leo never saw any of the other sisters only her alone so it can be assumed that no he did not know about Paige being an extra Charmed One as '67 Leo never met the other sisters or was told that Paige was from the future. Charmed Again Leo probably dismissed her as a mere look-alike. Or perhaps he just kept having met her before to himself as he did his past self's romance with past Piper in Pardon my Past. Besides it is not of importance to mention and would probably just cause more confusion than there already was with all of the events of Charmed Again.
There seem to be quite a few possibilities but we know for sure that Grams does not know as she said aloud that she would brew herself a forgetting potion.
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ljones
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Post by ljones on Jan 14, 2008 1:13:33 GMT -5
I don't think that it was possible for Leo's past self to be having an affair with Piper's past self (and great-grandmother) in 1924. Leo should have been born before 1924. According to Season 1 of "Love Hurts", Leo had been in medical school when he joined the Army in 1942. I have grave doubts that Leo had already earned a Bachelor's degree in Medicine by the age of 17-18 in 1942.
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