Esmeralda
Charmed
S2 "What If...?"
Fan Fic Winner
Twenty Years Gone....But Never Forgotten.
Posts: 21,920 
|
Post by Esmeralda on Dec 29, 2013 12:10:52 GMT -5
That's what I keep saying - she *didn't* love Cole, she only loved the lawyer he pretended to be. Did you ever get a chance to read the thread I mentioned? I know ljones read the first paragraph, but I don't think she read the whole thing. It's here: thecharmedcafe.proboards.com/thread/10982/cole-source-own-fault I'd love to know what *you* think of it. She was definitely capable of love - see her and Kyra in Season 7. Now that's love. |
|
|
|
Post by kriswyatthalliwell on Jan 26, 2014 0:51:07 GMT -5
Phoebe tried to love all of Cole, I won't deny that but she could love Belthazor as much as she loved "Cole"
She wanted to Sauvé lawyer man that was Cole but Belthazor like Es said is another story. lol Phoebe and Kyra were soo cute, I loved all of their interactions together. I always imagine Pheobe crying as hard as Piper did for Dr. Williamson when Zankou killed her.
|
|
aggiefan12
Familiar
Hello all you happy people
Posts: 129
|
Post by aggiefan12 on Jan 15, 2015 19:07:40 GMT -5
Yes, I think she truly loved Cole and may have tolerated Belthazor to a certain stage. Also wasn't it shax that killed Dr. Williamson? and Inspector Sheraton was killed by Zankou?
|
|
|
|
Post by Melinda Halliwell on Jan 15, 2015 22:07:47 GMT -5
Also wasn't it shax that killed Dr. Williamson? and Inspector Sheraton was killed by Zankou? No Dr Williamson was killed by the Halliwell sisters well Piper ultimately in the season 2 episode 'Astral Monkey'. Inspector Sheridan was killed by Zankou though yes. The doctor your talking about who was killed by Shax was Dr Griffiths in the season 3 finale 'All Hell Breaks Loose'. |
|
ljones
Whitelighter
Posts: 4,123
|
Post by ljones on Jan 19, 2015 21:56:16 GMT -5
"Yes, I think she truly loved Cole and may have tolerated Belthazor to a certain stage. Also wasn't it shax that killed Dr. Williamson? and Inspector Sheraton was killed by Zankou?"
Shax never killed Dr. Williamson. The Halliwells killed Dr. Williamson. And yes, Inspector Sheridan was killed by Zankou.
Phoebe truly loved Cole, but tolerated Belthazor? How did she achieve this, when Cole and Belthazor were one and the same? This only tells me that Phoebe never really loved him. She only loved what she thought she could "redeemed" to fit her image of an ideal man. And when matters got tough (namely the whole Source situation), she dumped him and spent several years trying to find the ideal man, until the Whitelighters dumped one into her lap . . . namely Coop. Phoebe's love life has been nothing but pathetic to me . . . right until the end. But what can you expect from a character who never really learned to grow up.
|
|
Nimue
Familiar
Posts: 606
|
Post by Nimue on Jan 20, 2015 11:02:43 GMT -5
That's what I keep saying - she *didn't* love Cole, she only loved the lawyer he pretended to be. Did you ever get a chance to read the thread I mentioned? I know ljones read the first paragraph, but I don't think she read the whole thing. It's here: thecharmedcafe.proboards.com/thread/10982/cole-source-own-fault I'd love to know what *you* think of it. She was definitely capable of love - see her and Kyra in Season 7. Now that's love. |
|
Nimue
Familiar
Posts: 606
|
Post by Nimue on Jan 20, 2015 11:06:48 GMT -5
As for whether or not Phoebe loved Cole, I've always believed she loved him in a certain way, in the way that people do when they first fall in love: it doesn't always make sense, it's very passionate, but sometimes the two people involved aren't right for each other. I also think that at that point Phoebe was too immature and not strong enough to get involved in such an intense and difficult relationship. It doesn't mean she didn't love him, it just means she didn't love him the right way.
|
|
Esmeralda
Charmed
S2 "What If...?"
Fan Fic Winner
Twenty Years Gone....But Never Forgotten.
Posts: 21,920
|
Post by Esmeralda on Jan 20, 2015 11:14:36 GMT -5
That kind of love is called infatuation, when you love what you want the person to be like, not what they are truly like. And I'll agree totally that Phoebe was infatuated with Cole, and I think he was infatuated with her. In both situations, that's why it would never work.
|
|
ljones
Whitelighter
Posts: 4,123
|
Post by ljones on Jan 23, 2015 2:07:27 GMT -5
Considering Cole's penchant of wrapping his world around Phoebe, which I never liked, it is possible that he was infatuated with her. I hope the comics give him an ending that includes a healthy relationship.
|
|
|
|
Post by lilchi7212 on Jul 27, 2015 18:30:21 GMT -5
Yeah she did truly love him. I think it started out as an infauation but I believe it did grow into a real love. Some of the symtoms of the reality of love that I read from a marriage counselor's book described Phoebe's and Cole relationship as they grew as couple. Season 5 seemed to change everything I guess cause Julian was leaving.
|
|
Esmeralda
Charmed
S2 "What If...?"
Fan Fic Winner
Twenty Years Gone....But Never Forgotten.
Posts: 21,920
|
Post by Esmeralda on Jul 27, 2015 19:03:00 GMT -5
No, it changed because Phoebe couldn't accept the fact that it was her fault that she had turned evil. She had to blame someone and since she couldn't blame herself, she blamed Cole. In the same way, Cole never loved her - he was only obsessed with her, just like in the comics. Thanks to that he stalked her in Season 5 and wouldn't take no for an answer. Everything he did is classic stalker, which shows he wanted power over her, not that he loved her. If he truly loved her, he would've left her alone. And had he left her alone, she might have gone back to him. By stalking her, she never would.
But both only thought of themselves, not of the other or what they wanted/needed as a couple.
Again, it's why they would never work as a couple. When both think that the world revolves totally around them and their wants and their needs and not others, it can't.
|
|
|
|
Post by lilchi7212 on Aug 8, 2015 16:43:44 GMT -5
No, it changed because Phoebe couldn't accept the fact that it was her fault that she had turned evil. She had to blame someone and since she couldn't blame herself, she blamed Cole. In the same way, Cole never loved her - he was only obsessed with her, just like in the comics. Thanks to that he stalked her in Season 5 and wouldn't take no for an answer. Everything he did is classic stalker, which shows he wanted power over her, not that he loved her. If he truly loved her, he would've left her alone. And had he left her alone, she might have gone back to him. By stalking her, she never would. But both only thought of themselves, not of the other or what they wanted/needed as a couple. Again, it's why they would never work as a couple. When both think that the world revolves totally around them and their wants and their needs and not others, it can't. Go watch the show again |
|
Esmeralda
Charmed
S2 "What If...?"
Fan Fic Winner
Twenty Years Gone....But Never Forgotten.
Posts: 21,920
|
Post by Esmeralda on Aug 8, 2015 17:06:14 GMT -5
No, it changed because Phoebe couldn't accept the fact that it was her fault that she had turned evil. She had to blame someone and since she couldn't blame herself, she blamed Cole. In the same way, Cole never loved her - he was only obsessed with her, just like in the comics. Thanks to that he stalked her in Season 5 and wouldn't take no for an answer. Everything he did is classic stalker, which shows he wanted power over her, not that he loved her. If he truly loved her, he would've left her alone. And had he left her alone, she might have gone back to him. By stalking her, she never would. But both only thought of themselves, not of the other or what they wanted/needed as a couple. Again, it's why they would never work as a couple. When both think that the world revolves totally around them and their wants and their needs and not others, it can't. Go watch the show again I'll tell you the same exact thing. If you want to believe that obsession is love, go right ahead. I just feel sorry for you if you ever run into an abuser - you'll let him abuse you because you think that's love. I know because I was in that situation when I was a whole lot younger. Thank God I know better now. I hope if it happens to you, you will, too. |
|
|
|
Post by Sadrick on Aug 8, 2015 22:14:08 GMT -5
Phoebe didn't truly love Cole because she couldn't accept his alter-ego known as Belthazor? What does that mean? I'm sure she recognised and accepted that there was always that demonic pit of iniquity inside of Cole. What else was she supposed to do? Have him alternate between the two forms so she can get to better know the cruel assassin that he once was? I guess by that same token Prue never really cared for Brendan since all she was concerned about was removing the mutated warlock half of his nature instead of growing to appreciate that part of him as well.
I don't begrudge either of the sisters for trying to help those like Brendan and Cole steer away from their dark sides. Their moral compasses are different (at least it was back then). It's one thing to accept someone for who they are and maybe show that person some leniency since they're trying to reform while suppressing those dark inclinations that make them killers, but to argue that it's selfish for wanting them to embrace their human sides?
Ironically, Cole did try to move on from Phoebe twice in late S3 and early S5, and both times one of the sisters reeled him back in using some kind of potion or spell. Sure, he may have eventually became what qualifies as a stalker, but it was the sisters who opened that door in the first place. It doesn't help that Phoebe is the reason behind Cole's last hope for salvation being ruined when she killed the wizard whom he was in the process of trading the Source's powers with.
|
|
Esmeralda
Charmed
S2 "What If...?"
Fan Fic Winner
Twenty Years Gone....But Never Forgotten.
Posts: 21,920
|
Post by Esmeralda on Aug 10, 2015 12:20:26 GMT -5
Phoebe didn't truly love Cole because she couldn't accept his alter-ego known as Belthazor? What does that mean? I'm sure she recognised and accepted that there was always that demonic pit of iniquity inside of Cole. What else was she supposed to do? Have him alternate between the two forms so she can get to better know the cruel assassin that he once was? I guess by that same token Prue never really cared for Brendan since all she was concerned about was removing the mutated warlock half of his nature instead of growing to appreciate that part of him as well. I don't begrudge either of the sisters for trying to help those like Brendan and Cole steer away from their dark sides. Their moral compasses are different (at least it was back then). It's one thing to accept someone for who they are and maybe show that person some leniency since they're trying to reform while suppressing those dark inclinations that make them killers, but to argue that it's selfish for wanting them to embrace their human sides? Ironically, Cole did try to move on from Phoebe twice in late S3 and early S5, and both times one of the sisters reeled him back in using some kind of potion or spell. Sure, he may have eventually became what qualifies as a stalker, but it was the sisters who opened that door in the first place. It doesn't help that Phoebe is the reason behind Cole's last hope for salvation being ruined when she killed the wizard whom he was in the process of trading the Source's powers with. Thank you. You're absolutely right. I may have to reconsider my reactions towards Cole.... I'm proud to be a fan who is willing to admit when she's been proven wrong - or even she *might* have been proven wrong.  |
|
ljones
Whitelighter
Posts: 4,123
|
Post by ljones on Aug 19, 2015 21:04:26 GMT -5
Leo committed evil. Despite that, Piper continued to love him. The Halliwells committed evil, yet they continued to love each other. Since when does love have to do with moral compass? And why does Phoebe have to love only a human?
|
|
|
|
Post by erikamarie on Aug 20, 2015 5:23:47 GMT -5
Blaise Pascal said that men are neither angels nor beasts, but angels and beasts at the same time
Could we love only angels?
I doubt it
|
|
|
|
Post by lilchi7212 on Aug 20, 2015 9:08:32 GMT -5
Blaise Pascal said that men are neither angels nor beasts, but angels and beasts at the same time Could we love only angels? I doubt it You should put that quote in your signature of your profile. |
|
Esmeralda
Charmed
S2 "What If...?"
Fan Fic Winner
Twenty Years Gone....But Never Forgotten.
Posts: 21,920
|
Post by Esmeralda on Aug 20, 2015 18:36:38 GMT -5
Blaise Pascal said that men are neither angels nor beasts, but angels and beasts at the same time Could we love only angels? I doubt it You're right about that. But Cole was much more demon than Leo was angel. |
|
|
|
Post by lilchi7212 on Aug 26, 2015 11:04:14 GMT -5
Blaise Pascal said that men are neither angels nor beasts, but angels and beasts at the same time Could we love only angels? I doubt it You're right about that. But Cole was much more demon than Leo was angel. So what! |
|
