colehellsangel
Familiar
In Love and War; or in this case Love IS war.
Posts: 797
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Post by colehellsangel on Dec 12, 2007 21:49:11 GMT -5
Yes that is indeed puzzling. I am afraid I can not think of an explanation to that one. Their focus seemed to be on the wizard though not Cole. He(The Wizard) had double crossed them and they had learned that wizards are very powerful when containing the powers of the source. I guess they were focused more on the wizard not getting the powers than Cole ridding himself of them. But that explains squat, I've got nothing.  |
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ljones
Whitelighter
Posts: 4,123
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Post by ljones on Dec 13, 2007 1:44:06 GMT -5
I don't see how exorcising the Source's spirit from Cole would be more difficult than killing him. If they were capable of finding a way to do one, they could have found a way to do the other. Right but also considering what you are saying about Wiccian Priests and the girls being nothing but Sorceresses. I believe only Priests can Exorcise and as you state the girls are not Priests. So . . . you agree that the sisters were never really witches? That's strange. I thought that wizard magic was more difficult and complicated than the magic practiced by witches. |
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colehellsangel
Familiar
In Love and War; or in this case Love IS war.
Posts: 797
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Post by colehellsangel on Dec 13, 2007 3:24:56 GMT -5
No they are witches, its stated many times in the show, I was just using your point of view and its true that the sisters are not as high up as Grams(since she was qualified to perform wiccanings and weddings).
Yeah that's what I mean so they were scared of him getting the source's power.
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ljones
Whitelighter
Posts: 4,123
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Post by ljones on Dec 13, 2007 17:40:01 GMT -5
No they are witches, its stated many times in the show, I was just using your point of view and its true that the sisters are not as high up as Grams(since she was qualified to perform wiccanings and weddings). Yeah that's what I mean so they were scared of him getting the source's power. Actually, the sisters were quite capable of performing an exorcism. Contrary to what is believed, religious figures like priests or priestesses are not the only ones capable of performing an exorcism. If an individual or individuals are graces with special skills or powers, he/she or they can also perform an exorcism. |
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colehellsangel
Familiar
In Love and War; or in this case Love IS war.
Posts: 797
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Post by colehellsangel on Dec 13, 2007 17:46:03 GMT -5
Ok see I am learning from you. About all this priest stuff I mean.
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Marqelle
Familiar
Be Vewy Vewy Quiet, We're Hunting Demons. - Phoebe Halliwell
Posts: 140
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Post by Marqelle on Jan 4, 2008 21:48:51 GMT -5
Well, to start a conversation again....here it goes.
I think that Phoebe and Cole couldn't have lasted because they both needed to much attention....if Cole didn't get attention he would go off and do something evil..or rather if he didn't get constant attention. And Phoebe needed a lot of attention too since they were going through that period of self centeredness. They both just needed to much attention from eachother that they couldn't give, and in return, couldn't recieve.
Hopefully that starts a new conversation.
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Post by marienomad on Jan 5, 2008 5:43:37 GMT -5
I thought that Cole gave Phoebe lots of attention but Phoebe refuses to acknowledge him.
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Marqelle
Familiar
Be Vewy Vewy Quiet, We're Hunting Demons. - Phoebe Halliwell
Posts: 140
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Post by Marqelle on Jan 5, 2008 13:57:00 GMT -5
That is a good point...I thought that was really rude of her...and the othes too...if they would have, maybe he would've been good...just maybe lol.
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ljones
Whitelighter
Posts: 4,123
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Post by ljones on Jan 6, 2008 21:31:07 GMT -5
Cole had failed to live up to Phoebe and her family's ideal of what a man is supposed to be. She wanted a man who would not remind her of her own moral ambiguity. Frankly, I found that sad. I think I can say the same for her sisters, because the show allowed them to fall for guys who seem superficially good . . . almost to the point of being ridiculously "noble".
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Post by vandergraafk on Jan 7, 2008 18:27:17 GMT -5
Would it help to talk about specific stages in their relationship (as dictated by the writers)? I merely suggest this because it seems to me that, although one might talk generally about their relationship (co-dependency anyone?), part of the dynamics of that - and any - relationship depend on events and circumstances surrounding a relationship. For example, Phoebe is very, very angry at Cole in The Good, the Bad and the Cursed. Why? She felt betrayed by Cole, a handsome ADA who had shown much interest in Phoebe, but revealed himself as a half-demonic would be assasin. She also felt betrayed by Cole in A Witch's Tale. However, that betrayal took place against a recent history where Phoebe had become queen of the underworld and had trusted Cole. She can recover from the first betrayal, but not the second.
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ljones
Whitelighter
Posts: 4,123
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Post by ljones on Jan 7, 2008 23:16:59 GMT -5
Would it help to talk about specific stages in their relationship (as dictated by the writers)? I merely suggest this because it seems to me that, although one might talk generally about their relationship (co-dependency anyone?), part of the dynamics of that - and any - relationship depend on events and circumstances surrounding a relationship. For example, Phoebe is very, very angry at Cole in The Good, the Bad and the Cursed. Why? She felt betrayed by Cole, a handsome ADA who had shown much interest in Phoebe, but revealed himself as a half-demonic would be assasin. She also felt betrayed by Cole in A Witch's Tale. However, that betrayal took place against a recent history where Phoebe had become queen of the underworld and had trusted Cole. She can recover from the first betrayal, but not the second. I have a problem with this. One, Phoebe was angry over Cole's revelation as a demonic assassin in "Sleuthing With the Enemy", not in "The Good, the Bad and the Cursed". It was Prue who had expressed this anger . . . especially when Cole deliberately set out to win back Phoebe. Two, Cole DID NOT betray Phoebe in Season 4. It was the Source inside Cole's body. But the idiotic writers didn't bother to let the Halliwells know. They didn't allow Cole to tell them what really happened. Nor did they allow the Halliwells to discover on their own, the truth about Cole being possessed. Then Kern had decided to confuse the viewers even further by allowing Phoebe to display tender feelings toward Cole in the Season 4 finale, "Witch Way Is Now?". Then in the Season 5 premiere, "A Witch's Tail", she is acting angry and "betrayed" at Cole. |
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Post by vandergraafk on Jan 8, 2008 18:55:33 GMT -5
Of course, I was off by one episode. I didn't mean the Good, the Bad and the Cursed. Phoebe was obviously in no position to be angry at Cole. Rather, I meant Bride and Gloom, the episode prior. She has an angry exchange with Cole in the mauseleum just before Prue has been captured by the Priestess. Suddenly, Phoebe embraces Cole wildly as the sisters begin their descent into evil with the turning of Prue.
As for Season 4: well, we've had this debate/discussion numerous times. Again, although it is a bit confusing who is speaking for whom in Season 4 - is it Cole or the Source - especially when Cole/Source learns he is to be a daddy, the writers gave Cole an opportunity to be straight with Phoebe in the Three Faces of Phoebe. One might speculate that Cole was powerless to give a true answer to Phoebe's question. One could equally argue that Cole made no obvious attempt to overcome the Source's possession in order to leave a trail for Phoebe to follow in order to learn the truth. There wasn't even an attempt to replicate on any scale the efforts of Piper to reveal that she was being possessed in Coyote Piper.
As for Witch Way Now and A Witch's Tale, I suppose we have to infer that those "tender feelings" that re-emerged in Witch Way Now were lost for good when Cole chose to remain in the Wasteland six or seven months in order to collect a massive amount of demonic powers. Hence, the jarring juxtaposition that we all see may dissolve once we take time into account. If not 6 months, then the three months between the final broadcast of Season 4 (May) and the initial broadcast of Season 5 (October).
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ljones
Whitelighter
Posts: 4,123
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Post by ljones on Jan 8, 2008 19:08:34 GMT -5
You know, I was going to make a pithy comeback remark. But I'm just too tired of reading excuses for the poor writing on this show.
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Esmeralda
Charmed
S2 "What If...?"
Fan Fic Winner
Twenty Years Gone....But Never Forgotten.
Posts: 21,920 
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Post by Esmeralda on Jan 9, 2008 13:16:06 GMT -5
ROFLMFAO!! For once, ljones, we are in COMPLETE agreement!
So for that you have been blessed!
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Post by vandergraafk on Jan 9, 2008 18:57:07 GMT -5
The blind blessing the blind? Oh well!
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Marqelle
Familiar
Be Vewy Vewy Quiet, We're Hunting Demons. - Phoebe Halliwell
Posts: 140
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Post by Marqelle on Jan 9, 2008 21:11:35 GMT -5
Wow...on all the forums I have been posting on they have a good conversation...then it fades into a little...well I wouldn't really say arguement..but I will...
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Post by vandergraafk on Jan 9, 2008 21:18:05 GMT -5
Just remember, Marquelle, this is the V.I.P. zone where the debate sometimes gets downright savage. Actually, it wouldn't if some people would take the time to read other postings carefully and respond analytically rather than try to take cheap shots or hide behind a wall of "opinion". Opinion without analysis is like beer without alcohol. You might as well drink piss. On the one side you have whitelightertony and me (although we disagree on certain points of view we do so amicably). On another side, there are a couple of posters who a) have an axe to grind against Charmed in part or on the whole or b) refuse to read the postings of others who do not share their narrow-minded views yet second the postings of others who couldn't argue their way out of a paper bag. I guess that's what the internet is all about!
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Marqelle
Familiar
Be Vewy Vewy Quiet, We're Hunting Demons. - Phoebe Halliwell
Posts: 140
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Post by Marqelle on Jan 10, 2008 21:07:57 GMT -5
Haha, well, I don't mind...it's kind of entertaining lol. The one thing I have noticed every time someone points out something to me and uses my name...is they never spell it right lol...even though I have never met them and said my name outloud..it always gets spelled wrong lol...anyways....carry on.
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Post by vandergraafk on Jan 10, 2008 21:34:06 GMT -5
That's because we all think that there ought to be a "u" there. You know: Marquette University; Marquis de Sade; maquilladoras; etc. There's always a "u". Do "U" get my drift?
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Marqelle
Familiar
Be Vewy Vewy Quiet, We're Hunting Demons. - Phoebe Halliwell
Posts: 140
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Post by Marqelle on Jan 11, 2008 0:19:04 GMT -5
Cute. =] yes, I get it. My name is french...but my dad was quite illiterate (i don't think I spelled that right) which isn't very supportive to my point lol.
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