Paige: Whitelighter/Witch

[Triad]

I think it's also a figure of speech. Angel is refered to the "Good", but Angels are nothing more than slaves of the "higher" being, such as the Angels of Destiny and Death(they do not seem to have a free will). Plus, I do not think angels are allowed to get a lady pregnant.....twice

[starr]

I guess everyone just wants to argue and never agree with anything I say. So you can think what you want, I say it was NOT a figure of speech.

[vandergraafk]

No, starr, I don't believe everyone just wants to argue. What some of us are trying to do is to make sense of language that was used in the series. Since language matters a lot, then it is important to be as precise as possible. Piper and Grams using the word angel to refer to Leo (the whitelighter) is important to note. It is a tenant of literary analysis, however, that characters are not omniscient.

Now, when another character - the whitelighter himself - disputes the phrase being used - as Maracev points out - then there is no doubt as to the lack of omniscience. They may see him as an angel, but that usage is neither descriptive of "reality" nor illuminating with respect to the structure of good: Elders, whitelighters, etc. Moreover, the angel of death and the angel of destiny are not on the side of good. They are "neutral" players in this eternal struggle between good and evil. Use of the word "angel" then to describe whitelighters muddles the issue even further.

It would be nice to refer to a book on Charmed that lays all of this out. It remains to be seen what The Book of Shadows Volume 2 will bring to us. But, as I understand it, Brad Kern and the writing staff only had a slim reference guide for the series. This was probably used as a sort of "bible". But, it can't have been sufficient, as many of us have pointed out errors. For example, Paige has already seen the Source and helped vanquish him. Yet, in Season 8, we are supposed to accept that she hasn't ever met him. Or, that Grams in Forever Charmed doesn't know her granddaughters - Prue, Piper and Phoebe - are the Charmed Ones, even though she has learned this in That 70s Episode, an episode that time-wise predates the time travel in Forever Charmed. Moreover, there is every reason to believe that Grams could not have cast a "forget this" spell at the end of That 70s Episode because she needs to cast a spell to bind the sisters' powers when Phoebe is born.

I worry that you confuse analysis with an attack either on a show you love or a character you cherish. Let me assure you that the contributors in this discussion have the highest motives. I appreciate their comments - and yours - as they help me clarify things in my mind and remind me of things that have slipped into the recesses of my mind, despite many, many viewings. I knew Piper had referred to Leo as an angel. I had forgotten that Grams had as well. Thanks to Maracev, I remember when Leo reminded us and Piper that he was well not really an angel.
Hang in there!

[Paige Yin]

I must admit that I don't like Paige at first.But now,she became my favorite sister!She is fun,classy,playful but responsible,wild,sexy...I think she is probably better than Prue!And of course,I like that she love to help people,that make her a great Whitelighter/witch.

[vandergraafk]

The final classic Charmed episode on the dying WB brought us "Witches in Tights", an altogether fun episode that unfortunately adds more confusion to whether whitelighters are angels and who exactly the Elders are. In this episode, both Piper and Raemus refer to Leo as an angel, while Leo indicates that the Elders are sort of like kings. As tantalizing as these references are, they do not help settle the question, but only add further confusion.

In previous episodes, Piper has referred to Leo as an angel. So, the fact that she describes Leo as an angel is no surprise. We know from Primrose Empath that Leo has already dismissed this as incorrect when he dismissed Piper's claim as not really true. Yet, why then would Raemus refer to Leo as an angel, especially a passive angel, after Leo has stepped out of character to save Raemus from attack? This is puzzling indeed, when a retiring Elder should know better.

The ascension of the young Kevin to Elder status confuses the Charmed Ones and the audience as well. In the past, it seemed as if Elders were wiser, more experienced entities in the hierarchy of good. Though their rules were irksome, the Charmed Ones couldn't just ignore them, although Piper did her best to break them when she could. The Elders possessed authority, an authority perhaps based on their past experience as whitelighters. With Kevin, though, we learn that some are born to be Elders. No experience is necessary, but special powers, such as the one that Kevin had to conjure mental pictures into being through the act of drawing, may be required.

So, who are the Elders and what powers do they have? Were some of them witches at one time? Were others whitelighters who have moved on? The answers to these questions may explain how Gideon and Odin obtained their magical powers. It may also explain how Leo acquired his powers when he became an Elder. Yet, the answers to these questions are not obvious.

[HollysFan]

In this episode, both Piper and Raemus refer to Leo as an angel, while Leo indicates that the Elders are sort of like kings

He just meant that people can become elders at a young age just as princes can become kings at a young age.

[MarAcev]

That's exactly what he meant given that he clarified: "Elders are like kings, they can be any age."

[vandergraafk]

I will grant you that as the intended meaning. It does not, however, clarify the status of the Elders. How does one get to be an Elder? The ascension of Kevin to this status means that some are born - or predisposed - to be Elders. Moreover, they may have come from the ranks of witches, as Kevin clearly has some powers.

Is this the only path to becoming an Elder? Are whitelighters of a proven track record invited to join the ranks of Elderdom? If so, then this would explain why Elders from this source don't have powers. Leo is a problem, but his ascension to Elder status was rather exceptional and involved the invocation of forbidden powers.

One would think this could become clearer at some point. It's not, and that's why this whole notion of Elders with powers is frustrating. It's also why it's difficult to straighten out definitively this whitelighters versus angels mess.

[MarAcev]

Is this the only path to becoming an Elder?

We know that's not how Leo became one and Gideon seemed to be also a promoted whitelighter.

[vandergraafk]

Yes, how exactly did Leo become a whitelighter? Was it a reward for his services in saving the remaining Elders? Maybe. Was it the result of spending too much time in the heavens? Remember his hair was turning white on the sides and was used to indicate that Leo, too, was undergoing a change. Would Leo have eventually become a whitelighter after his years of service to the Charmed Ones and his other charges?

[*Sammi!*]

I think it was a mixture of both saving the Elders and spending alot of time in the Heavens... and maybe like he said, maybe his love for Piper took him to a whole new level of greatness... You never know really do ya...

[MarAcev]

Poor Piper. As if losing him wasn't enough, it turned out to be her fault too.

[vandergraafk]

Come on, Maracev, how do you arrive at that result? I don't think Piper blamed herself for losing Leo. True, there were already marital difficulties. But, Leo did not become an Elder to flea Piper.

On the other hand, Piper may have blamed herself for what happened to Leo in Season 7. She felt powerless to help him ward off the Avatar voices and masks that plagued Leo. Nor could she assuage the anger Leo felt toward the death of Chris and the attempt on Wyatt's life. Not even the chance to cradle baby Chris could sway Leo. In this case, I would say poor Piper!

[*Sammi!*]

No, he said that theyre love was that great that it brought him to a new level of greatness.. or something like that, in that sense, maybe Piper did blame herself because they loved each ither fiercly....?

[Jamie]

I like Paige!

[*Sammi!*]

Paige rocks my socks!!

[stephl2010]

does anybody know where they got roses or paiges one shoulder shirts from i have pics of them and would like 2 get one?

[*Sammi!*]

Check Ebay, I know that some people have bought some things from Charmed on there.

[TruelyCharmed]

I think i prefer Paige as a Witch rather than a Whitelighter because she is afterall a Charmed One, she clearly seems more comfortable and confident as a witch which draws your attention towards her. Her whitelighter side only started developing in Season 7 (i think) so we haven't had much insight to her Whitelighter side.

Overall, i think Paige is great, Rose Mc Gowon brought a whole new breeze of fresh air along with her. I wouldn't have it any other way with Paige. She is equally as stubborn as Piper and Phoebe doesn't want to let down her family nor does she like to be wrong. All these great qualities and traits she has makes her a great witch and spirit to watch.

TruelyCharmed.

[elderess]

Yeh, I prefer Paige as a Witch too!
But if she wasn't a whitelighter as well, (except Leo) who would teach the next generation how to be a whitelighter?