When did Charmed get its jump the shark moment?

[Aaeiyn]

Sept 1, 2023 7:16:52 GMT -5 myystery said:

Aaeiyn
I know Charmed always had some overarching storylines, but I felt they were more like "you get to see it when you pay attention and watch all episodes" and not essential to the enjoyment of a single episode.

And which episodes make you feel like the overall arching storyline feel a little "too essential" to your enjoyment of a single episode?

Sept 1, 2023 7:16:52 GMT -5 myystery said:

I also loved many episodes of the first four seasons which were fun and with plenty of comedy, but those were funny within the framework of a show that took itself at least halfway serious. From Season 5 on, the show went silly and that was my breaking point. 

This just solidifies my point with this thread, I made awhile back. I suppose some (not all) of the Charmed fandom prefers a little bit more of a "serious" show vs a "silly" one.

Sept 1, 2023 14:28:34 GMT -5 aggiefan12 said:

They do have some sway but they still have to answer to the executive producers

And, the Executive Producers have to answer to the Network.

Nobody is arguing the chain of command.

What I'm saying is that both Holly & Alyssa became producers in S5 which gives them some (keyword here) say, over the direction of the show. I would think having a producer title would be more stabilizing in having that authority than without it (looks at what happened to Shannen).

[wiccawonder]

Jul 31, 2023 5:03:45 GMT -5 Keeper Of Melinda's Locket said:

I've been thinking long and hard about this. I haven't made my mind up yet, but I'm going to note down several potential points for now and some I picked up from reading this thread and put together in this post.

NOTE: I haven't got time right now to write in cons for all the others yet. But anybody is feel to add to the list. 

I see we have a growing the beard moment thread somewhere. But I can't find it. I saw it a week ago. Nice to pin-point that in comparison with the jumping the shark moment. You'll get to figure out what IS CHARMED for you. With your ideal season being between the growing the beard moment and jump the shark moment.

1) Leo is healed and brought back by Piper and sticks around going into S2. - Love Hurts

CONS: Moving Forward
*More whitelighter mythology which leads to Elders which leads to Up There.
*Damaging Piper's character in the long run.
*The creation of half-white lighters.

2) Andy's death - Deja Vu All Over Again

CONS: Moving forward.
*The show feels less grounded with a mortal/non-magical voice.
*Darryl's character has nobody to bounce off. And has no sense of purpose other than being a plot device for crime-related scenes.
*The sisters lose their grounded connection to someone from their past they all grew up with and new pre-becoming witches.
*The show becomes 70% magical (including Leo's character) and 30% grounded (Darryl, Dan S2, and then 10% grounded in S3 when Cole's introduced), where it was 50%/50% split with Andy in S1.


3) When Prue gets a new power and Astral Projects - Ms. Hellfire

4) When Leo proposed to Piper in the bathroom or When Cole makes the scene of the crime - The Honeymoon's Over

5) Piper's new power when she blew up the watermelon - Exit Strategy.

CONS: Moving forward.
*Less use of freezing power.
*Continuation of a second power for the sisters.
*Piper acting as a Power of One to blow up demons left and right.
*Less reliance on PO3 spells and being creative using their combined powers.

6) - When Phoebe lied to her sisters about Cole - Sleuthing With the Enemy

7) Prue's death - All Hell Breaks Loose

8) When Paige orbs - Charmed Again

9) When Coles eyes turn black - Charmed and Dangerous

10) Wyatt's birth - The Day the Magic Died

11) The Introduction of Magic School - The Legend of Sleepy Halliwell

12) The Introduction of Billie - Still Charmed and Kicking

I think I would happen to agree with most of these apart from the girls getting an advancement of their powers. I personally wasn’t shocked when this happened as I personally was excited and thought that advancement of powers would be a natural occurrence. I know a lot of people would disagree with me as a lot of people don’t agree with the girls advanced powers or having them at all. I do know people go on about how Piper blowing up demons is a Power of One thing but if Prue was still alive, her power would become explosive eventually as well. So yeah.

I would like to add to this timeline the very first time they was mentioned which is in Morality Bites when the girls are returned to the past and they talk about how they sent them back and then they question who they are and why. I think this may be one of the very first jump the shark moments.

[angelap]

I do see a debate for Wyatt's birth being the jump the shark moment. I don't see When Phoebe lied to her sisters about Cole being that moment at all, sorry. I just don't when Phoebe lied in prior episodes.

Wyatt's birth can be seen as when the real shift occurs when he becomes more important to plotlines and the shift to Piper's family leaving Phoebe and Paige lost at times in stories.

This is a good topic. I'll have to think about it some more.

[prueislove]

I feel like Piper being pregnant with Wyatt for the most part especially having a baby who can heal from the womb? I'm sorry, too crazy. But yes all of s6 which is the worst season of Charmed easily. It focused way more on their romantic lives than them as the Charmed Ones. Piper practically encouraged Phoebe and Paige to move out, Prue would have never allowed that.

[Aaeiyn]

Nov 16, 2024 23:17:12 GMT -5 prueislove said:

having a baby who can heal from the womb? I'm sorry, too crazy.

Not too crazy. Charmed ALWAYS had magical babies doing crazy things, from the womb:

S1E17 "That 70s Episode" - Fetus Phoebe giving Patty a premonition about the Charmed Ones from the future and then Patty using Fetus Phoebe, to "tap into the PO3" to send the Charmed Ones, back to their original timeline.

S4E19 "We're off to See the Wizard"-S4E20 "Long Live the Queen" - Signs of Fetus Source giving Phoebe access to fire burning/throwing, like in S2E14 "Pardon My Past"?

S4E21 "Womb Raider" - Fetus Source throwing a fit everytime somebody talks badly about Cole & taking over Phoebe's body to do it. Or turning the fruit into raw meat/throwing the "iced tea" (that was really a power binding potion) away.

The one pregnancy that felt the most "normal" was Chris', TBH. But, yes, Fetuses performing magic from the womb isn't new, and Wyatt was the last one, that I can think of, performing magic, from the womb, before the show stopped doing it.

[Aaeiyn]

I can't really say what my "jump the shark moment" was because my love & care for the show is all over the place xD

As soon as S2 began, I felt the show was just different from S1. S2 is just not the same, at all, like S1. But then S3 shows up, and I REALLY dig S3 more than S2 but not as much S1. S4 didn't quite capture me as much as it does, now. Back then S4 bored me. I USED to really love S5-S7 and then didn't care for S8. Now, I don't care for S5 but LOVE S8 xD

Again, I'm too all over the place to really say when it was because I love the show randomly in some seasons and not so much in others LOL

EDIT: I have ALWAYS been consistent in loving S1, S3 & S6, though.

[prueislove]

Nov 17, 2024 6:32:15 GMT -5 Aaeiyn said:

Nov 16, 2024 23:17:12 GMT -5 prueislove said:

having a baby who can heal from the womb? I'm sorry, too crazy.

Not too crazy. Charmed ALWAYS had magical babies doing crazy things, from the womb:

S1E17 "That 70s Episode" - Fetus Phoebe giving Patty a premonition about the Charmed Ones from the future and then Patty using Fetus Phoebe, to "tap into the PO3" to send the Charmed Ones, back to their original timeline.

S4E19 "We're off to See the Wizard"-S4E20 "Long Live the Queen" - Signs of Fetus Source giving Phoebe access to fire burning/throwing, like in S2E14 "Pardon My Past"?

S4E21 "Womb Raider" - Fetus Source throwing a fit everytime somebody talks badly about Cole & taking over Phoebe's body to do it. Or turning the fruit into raw meat/throwing the "iced tea" (that was really a power binding potion) away.

The one pregnancy that felt the most "normal" was Chris', TBH. But, yes, Fetuses performing magic from the womb isn't new, and Wyatt was the last one, that I can think of, performing magic, from the womb, before the show stopped doing it.

Giving a premonition is a lot less crazy than the stuff Phoebe's fetus and Piper's one did. Self-healing and making Piper OP and invincible while she was pregnant. Having a shield. That kind of stuff. Plus Wyatt performing magic from the womb was only the start. Being the master of escalibur, twice blessed brat and all that stuff really killed the vibe for me.

[Aaeiyn]

Nov 17, 2024 7:26:19 GMT -5 prueislove said:

Giving a premonition is a lot less crazy than the stuff Phoebe's fetus and Piper's one did.

IDK Patty being able to "tap into the PO3" (when, "the PO3" was canonized as "the most powerful source of magic", at the time) fits in line with the craziness of all those of "destined" canons.

Nov 17, 2024 7:26:19 GMT -5 prueislove said:

Wyatt performing magic from the womb was only the start. Being the master of escalibur, twice blessed brat and all that stuff really killed the vibe for me.

Oh IK Trust me. The "destined" canon for Prue is what killed it, for me, with her character, as well. This is why I don't like "destined" canon.

[prueislove]

For me, the issue wasn't destined canon. Like if they picked one thing for Wyatt and went with it. Same with Prue, Piper, Phoebe and Paige. Why can't they have one power each and that power grows? Like Piper can freeze and she can slow down time which fits in line with her freezing? Prue can use telekinisis, how that could grow is similar to Morality Bites Future Prue. Phoebe, I'm not sure but one power each. They're the Charmed Ones. They're already OP being the Charmed Ones.

[Aaeiyn]

Nov 17, 2024 7:36:34 GMT -5 prueislove said:

For me, the issue wasn't destined canon. Like if they picked one thing for Wyatt and went with it. Same with Prue, Piper, Phoebe and Paige. Why can't they have one power each and that power grows? Like Piper can freeze and she can slow down time which fits in line with her freezing? Prue can use telekinisis, how that could grow is similar to Morality Bites Future Prue. Phoebe, I'm not sure but one power each. They're the Charmed Ones. They're already OP being the Charmed Ones.

But, for Prue, not only was she "Charmed", she was "the strongest" merely for being "the oldest". On top of that, the show constantly made her position "the right/correct" position, and what Prue says, goes. I'm sorry, but she's NOT "the boss" of them. THAT part really irritated me, about her. Earliest example I can use to explain what I mean is in S1E3 "Thank You for Not Morphing", and she's telling her sisters they "can't" go see Victor. WTH?

[prueislove]

I've seen the oldest is the strongest a lot but yes, she was bossy. She was stern and over the top motherly but that was part of her character development. A lot of people say this but I felt at least she had direction and room for growth. S2 and S3 Prue was far too chill in these matters especially regarding her protectiveness over Piper and Phoebe. I'm unpopular but Prue not being protective over Phoebe regarding Cole as much when she worried so much when it came to Clay made me dislike her a bit. Another jump the shark moment.

[Aaeiyn]

Nov 17, 2024 7:43:55 GMT -5 prueislove said:

I've seen the oldest is the strongest a lot but yes, she was bossy. She was stern and over the top motherly but that was part of her character development. A lot of people say this but I felt at least she had direction and room for growth. S2 and S3 Prue was far too chill in these matters especially regarding her protectiveness over Piper and Phoebe. I'm unpopular but Prue not being protective over Phoebe regarding Cole as much when she worried so much when it came to Clay made me dislike her a bit. Another jump the shark moment.

I don't mind her "bossiness" but up to a certain extent. Can't stand it in something like S1E3 "Thank You for Not Morphing", when she DEMANDS they do NOT go see Victor. Situations like in S1E1 "Something Wicca This Way Comes", when she tells them to "get outta here, now" I'm fine with it, or in that same episode saying they need to "stick together" (which I agree with). That level is fine but NOT at the detriment of their freedom.

[prueislove]

In her defence, she's trying to protect them from going through the pain of abandonment that she went through so that's a little harsh. Like I said, I would rather that to Prue being way too chill in s2 and s3.

[Aaeiyn]

Nov 17, 2024 7:49:29 GMT -5 prueislove said:

In her defence, she's trying to protect them from going through the pain of abandonment that she went through so that's a little harsh. Like I said, I would rather that to Prue being way too chill in s2 and s3.

Even if that were true, it's not what she said, and that's just a guess from the fandom.

Unlike in S1E11 "Feats of Clay", when Prue explained WHY she had concerns with Clay.

[prueislove]

We guess it because we understand Prue. Prue's not the easiest character to understand when we meet her. She's more like their mom than their big sister, she had to sacrifice part of her childhood to help raise Piper and Phoebe. Anything she does is for them like a mother protects her child.

[Aaeiyn]

Nov 17, 2024 7:55:00 GMT -5 prueislove said:

We guess it because we understand Prue.

I still think she needs to say it in order to make it true. Us guessing is because of our own understanding of a character is just that. The same way Phoebe pulled it out of Prue in why Prue was REALLY mad at her, in S1E20 "The Power of Two" went BEYOND just the guess.

[prueislove]

That just kind of sounds more like you're looking for a debate then a real reason? Am I right?

[Aaeiyn]

Nov 17, 2024 8:03:37 GMT -5 prueislove said:

That just kind of sounds more like you're looking for a debate then a real reason? Am I right?

No, the reasons need to be clear and not just guessable/assumed. Which Charmed does explain a fair amount. Which S1 still has her explaining her reasons, just S1E3 "Thank You for Not Morphing" wasn't very clear. It's just one example. IK you don't like the S1E11 "Feats of Clay" protective Prue, but I do because she explains why she's doing it.

[prueislove]

Part of the fun of watching something for me is things not being explicitly stated. I'm a psyche major so digging deeper is always more fun for me. Also, I hope this doesn't sound rude but your argument here doesn't feel like a real argument.

[Aaeiyn]

Nov 17, 2024 22:29:02 GMT -5 prueislove said:

Part of the fun of watching something for me is things not being explicitly stated. I'm a psyche major so digging deeper is always more fun for me. Also, I hope this doesn't sound rude but your argument here doesn't feel like a real argument.

I get that and not rude, at all. Sometimes, I have hard time phrasing things in a way, for others to understand. Let me rephrase, I take issue in inserting individual interpretations as "canon". Unless, something is explicitly stated, I reject the concept of individual interpretation as "canon". We can't really know if that scene was her being bossy, or her protecting her sisters from her pain. Since neither was explicitly confirmed, other than her coming off as bossy (which is canon), I can only interpret that scene as Prue being bossy. Could the writers of written it better? Probably, but we can't be sure because she didn't say it.