Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 30, 2013 17:39:06 GMT -5
I don't think the show's decline had to do with Prue's death and Paige's introduction either. I didn't think there was anything wrong with season 4 at all... no more than any other season anyway.
I think the biggest thing that started the downward spiral was the direction they went with the characters that were left. Phoebe's character (right when Alyssa becomes a producer, make of that what you will) degenerates from a very likable character into an egocentric narcissist who I struggled to find redeeming qualities in more and more with each year. Piper was never right to be leader simply because she only tolerated being a witch in the first place and was ready to give it all up whenever the slightest magical issue got in the way of her "normal life".
I actually think Paige was the only one who genuinely cared all that much about their job once Prue was gone.
|
|
Esmeralda
Charmed
S2 "What If...?"
Fan Fic Winner
Twenty Years Gone....But Never Forgotten.
Posts: 21,920 
|
Post by Esmeralda on Oct 9, 2013 10:34:23 GMT -5
Keep in mind that being producers only gave Holly and Alyssa credit - they had no power - which is why Rose turned that down. So don't make of that what you will. The changes in the characters was all due to The WB trying to save their dying network by using sex.
But I agree totally that even had Prue not died, if the show had continued in the direction it took in Season Five, it still would've gone downhill, although personally I think a Season 4 without Paige and with Prue, where they wouldn't have had to rush Phoebe and Cole's story, would've been much better. I would've preferred the series either ending there or having Prue die at the end of Season Four (and I don't think Shannen would've wanted to continue beyond that - in most of the series she was part of, she got bored awful early) - saving an innocent who happens to be Paige, who you can then concentrate on during Season Five! And had it then ended after Season Five, we would've had a totally-engaged Rose, who as a movie actress, got bored with episodic televsion.
A much better series.
|
|
phoenixflame
Innocent
The power of four is quite the chore...
Posts: 63 
|
Post by phoenixflame on Oct 14, 2013 18:04:30 GMT -5
(Although this technically isn't the thread for this, I just feel it needs to be said.)
I think a really great way to go about the show after Prue's death is:
1)At the end of Prue's funeral, they see someone walking out of the church, back facing Piper and Phoebe, in the exact same clothes Prue was wearing when she died, exept the inner shirt (peeking out of the jacket's sleeve) is light blue.Ironically, they think nothing of it and go back home to mourn. The next morning Piper goes into the kitchen and sees Prue making cofee. Piper turns around to ramble to herself about the situation being impossible and when she turns back around, Prue's gone. Assuming she ran off she checks the washroom and basement; no Prue. She tells Phoebe and they try the "To Summon A Witch" spell; nothing happens. They tell Leo, he goes to the Elders, and comes back empty handed.When Shax comes to the manor to try and kill the other two sisters, Prue orbs in and kicks some demon (fill in the blank) ---.Before she can even think to orb out, Piper grabs her angry and in tears asking why she didn't tell Piper and Phoebe what the situation was.She tells them that the elders didn't want them to know until the time was right, or when she was needed.After Phoebe asks why she didn't TK throw Shax, Prue tells them she's not apart of the power of three anymore and is full whitelighter.She then also tells them that the Elders told her that there is a fourth sister and they go to rescue Paige before Shax kills her.Once she has been saved, Prue says goodbye, tells them she'll be in touch, orbs out, and the episode ends. She then also helps the power of three be reconstituted in "Charmed Again Part II", shows up briefly in Chris' timeline as his whitelighter (what that episode's named I don't remember at the moment), and is in the last three episodes of Charmed.
|
|
|
|
Post by kriswyatthalliwell on Dec 24, 2013 1:50:36 GMT -5
I always just assumed Prue had died of blood loss or hemorrhaging and by the time Leo got to the Manor, Piper was near death and Prue was dead. I was a little confused when Piper was talking to Leo during "Charmed Again Part 1" and said he healed the wrong sister, but I just took that as a writing inconsistency or Piper being emotional and needing someone to blame. Also Prue was bleeding out of her head and ears soo yeah... probably blood loss or something.
|
|
Esmeralda
Charmed
S2 "What If...?"
Fan Fic Winner
Twenty Years Gone....But Never Forgotten.
Posts: 21,920
|
Post by Esmeralda on Dec 24, 2013 9:47:26 GMT -5
That's what happened - it's why you see the blood coming out of Prue's ear which happens after one dies from blood hemorrhaging in the head - something that's *not* there at the beginning of the episode - and something that was added after Shannen was fired.
|
|
forbuss
Witch
currently watching season seven
Posts: 1,748
|
Post by forbuss on Dec 24, 2013 12:42:14 GMT -5
Oooh I will have to rematch for that Es, I totally missed that!
|
|
|
|
Post by kriswyatthalliwell on Dec 24, 2013 21:22:14 GMT -5
That's what happened - it's why you see the blood coming out of Prue's ear which happens after one dies from blood hemorrhaging in the head - something that's *not* there at the beginning of the episode - and something that was added after Shannen was fired. I should rewatch AHBL to check for the not bleeding out of ear in the beginning, very perceptive Es.  |
|
Esmeralda
Charmed
S2 "What If...?"
Fan Fic Winner
Twenty Years Gone....But Never Forgotten.
Posts: 21,920
|
Post by Esmeralda on Dec 26, 2013 12:30:14 GMT -5
Nope, not perceptive on my part - it's part of the "Did You Know?" at another site. I would've totally missed it.
|
|
forbuss
Witch
currently watching season seven
Posts: 1,748
|
Post by forbuss on Dec 27, 2013 18:47:13 GMT -5
Nope, not perceptive on my part - it's part of the "Did You Know?" at another site. I would've totally missed it. Could you link me to it?! Haha. |
|
Esmeralda
Charmed
S2 "What If...?"
Fan Fic Winner
Twenty Years Gone....But Never Forgotten.
Posts: 21,920
|
Post by Esmeralda on Dec 28, 2013 11:16:56 GMT -5
Afraid not. I thought I knew which site I found it, but it's not there, although there's a lot of other interesting facts there - most we already know, but not all. I'll have to keep hunting and see if I can find it. (shrugging) Unless they took it out of there. I don't know if that area can be edited.
|
|
|
|
Post by Astral Vision on Jan 5, 2014 11:19:39 GMT -5
That's what happened - it's why you see the blood coming out of Prue's ear which happens after one dies from blood hemorrhaging in the head - something that's *not* there at the beginning of the episode - and something that was added after Shannen was fired. Just finished my season three re-watch, which means AHBL is fresh in my head. I had read your post about this before I got around to re-watching that finale, so I paid particular attention to the beginning scene and the final scene of that episode. Both are exactly the same with the pool of blood coming out of Prue's ear. There is no difference between the two injured Prue shots (xD I feel like I am describing a "spot the difference"). |
|
Esmeralda
Charmed
S2 "What If...?"
Fan Fic Winner
Twenty Years Gone....But Never Forgotten.
Posts: 21,920
|
Post by Esmeralda on Jan 5, 2014 13:07:33 GMT -5
Wow! They must've added it to *both* scenes. Very bad on their part. It might also be why it was edited out of that "Did You Know?". Because I never would've even considered such a possibility if I hadn't read it.
|
|
|
|
Post by Astral Vision on Jan 5, 2014 18:28:51 GMT -5
I would presume the injury was always in both scenes. I doubt they added it to both scenes after it became clear Shannen Doherty was not returning to the show. Leo has to heal it the first time that scene is shown. Even though it's simpler than the majority of other effects on the show, the healing effect probably is not simple to edit to include an added injury vanishing.
|
|
|
|
Post by warrenwarlock on Jul 7, 2014 15:29:29 GMT -5
That's what happened - it's why you see the blood coming out of Prue's ear which happens after one dies from blood hemorrhaging in the head - something that's *not* there at the beginning of the episode - and something that was added after Shannen was fired. I saw it too, I remember clearly. They added the effect after Shannen was fired. Anyway the effect it's so simple to by added (trust me). |
|
|
|
Post by Darkhorse Christian on Jul 8, 2014 1:17:35 GMT -5
Just looked at it. They did add it to both scenes. If you look at both scenes, all the shots of Prue and Piper lying there do include the bleeding ear—except for the one where the blood disappears as Leo's healing finally kicks in. In that one, all the rest of the blood is there and then quickly disappears due to the healing, but Prue's ear isn't even bleeding at all.
|
|
|
|
Post by isaiah on Nov 4, 2014 20:05:12 GMT -5
She died when shax threw her through a wall. Then she came back in the comic books in a new body ironically her new body has blond hair just like her future self does
|
|
|
|
Post by xchris on Nov 7, 2014 6:41:01 GMT -5
I haven't read all 12 pages of this thread because that would take quite a lot of time... but there are some things i have to ask/say about this (i would make a thread on my own but i noticed that there is one already, before i do that).
So... i have watched episode 21 (sadly i couldn't find it in greek subs so i watched it in english mostly to see what happens there because i watched episode 22 first, when an episode doesn't work in the website which i am using to watch these i just skip it and go to the next) and i thought that it is the continuation from episode 21... at least that is what it looked like but then i found out that it has nothing to do with episode 22. Anyway that is not a problem, the problem has to do with the way episode 22 starts...Prue, Paiper and Phoebe going in their home with a doctor who they were trying to protect from a demon...and what i am wondering about is how did everything happen so fast? Why did they skip so many things? And that was just the beggining... the huge skipping comes later. They don't show us a thing about how they found out what would happen and gotten to the doctor before the demon attacks. Then the demon attacks, he hits both Prue and Paiper but Phoebe saves the doctor with a spell that made the demon go away and Lio manages to heal the 2 sisters who were lying on the ground. All fine till now...the shiz starts when they go outside because Prue had a feeling that the demon would be alive and somewhere around. They face the demon and a reporter with a camera is doing a live broadcast around there?!? Is this a joke or what? They didn't get caught all those years of using magic and it just happened like this? It doesn't make any sense to me. And anyway that is not the actual problem. The problem also isn't from where in the world that extremely dumb blonde witch appears and starts shouting shiz... srsly that was the most lame part of that episode. Then she manages to get a gun in her hands and use it to shoot Paiper... ok just no comment to all these coincidences that are there fck up their lives. But i tried to accept all this bs because at the end of the episode something logical was about to happen... Cole would make a deal with the Source in order to get Tempous the warlock, reverse time and start the day from the beggining. Then Cole would warn the sisters before Shax attacks and everything would be fine. We never saw Tempous doing anything and we also never saw Cole appearing to warn Prue and Paiper and no reason was given for that so what the hell is going on? We just see Shax attacking, hitting the sisters, then the doctor as Phoebe wasn't there to do anything and then leaving.. And i am wondering... why Cole didn't go up there to warn them, what happened to Lio who was down there and from what they said this reversing thing doesn't have any effect to the ppl in the underworld? Why couldn't he heal them both when he has already done it once? Why we won't see what happens when Lio gotten there and how Cole and Phoebe escaped from the Source and the underworld? And this "Prue was more hurt than Paiper" is pure bs because Lio managed to heal them last time so it shouldn't be any different this one. If they wanted to remove Prue from the series then they did it in the worst way possible. When i started watching charmed i did it from the 4th season and after because that is all that a tv channel where i live, had What i always thought is that the Source killed Prue and i guess you can understand how dissapointing it is to find out that she died from a mere demon who could have been killed with a simple spell. And at episode 1 from season 4 Page's current boyfriend gets attacked from the same attack that Shax used to kill Prue and almost nothing happens to him? I mean we have seen Prue surviving from so many things, this shouldn't be enough to kill her. They should have thought of something more to get her out of the charmed series.
|
|
Esmeralda
Charmed
S2 "What If...?"
Fan Fic Winner
Twenty Years Gone....But Never Forgotten.
Posts: 21,920
|
Post by Esmeralda on Nov 7, 2014 9:57:26 GMT -5
This is all part of why unlike so many fans "All Hell Breaks Loose" is *not* one of my favorite episodes - I hate that in Prue's last episode, she and Piper acted absolutely STUPID!
|
|
Esmeralda
Charmed
S2 "What If...?"
Fan Fic Winner
Twenty Years Gone....But Never Forgotten.
Posts: 21,920
|
Post by Esmeralda on Nov 7, 2014 10:11:59 GMT -5
Decided to bump this up since it pretty much is my answer to what you wrote. I definitely blame Phoebe for Prue's death, and Leo should take on some of the blame, too. Leo left Prue and Piper to fend for themselves, knowing that they had just been exposed and needed him very badly. He shouldn't have followed Phoebe to the underworld when she went to turn Cole back to good, or if he did, he should've just grabbed her and orbed back....There was no reason for him to leave his two charges alone while the neighborhoood found out they were witches..... He messed up badly there..... Then again I also blame Piper and Prue. Had they not tried to vanquish Shax (with only a power of two!) out in the open, Prue would not have died. What they all did didn't make a lot of sense, part of why I'm not as crazy over "All Hell Breaks Loose" as most fans are. I still think that if it had gone the way it was originally supposed to - identical - but Prue and Piper would both survive while Phoebe would be down in the Underworld where she would become the Queen of the Underworld without needing the Hollow or Cole becoming mortal or any of that other crap - "All Hell Breaks Loose" wouldn't even make most fans' top 25 episodes list. But I still think it's much more Phoebe's. If she didn't put Cole in front of her sisters, none of this would've ever happened. Remember this conversation: Leo: How'd it go?
Piper: We dodged another bullet.
Prue: Yeah, with him maybe.
Leo: What do you mean?
Prue: I don't know, I mean, something still bothers me about the way that we vanquished Shax. Like, I'm not so sure we really did.
Piper: What do you mean? He screamed, he went poof, just like they all do. Third demon in a row, by the way, that I vanquished with my new power, but who's counting?
(Phoebe walks back in.)
Prue: Right, but if that's all that we needed, then why was there a vanquishing spell in the book? I mean, hasn't that always meant that our individual powers weren't enough?
Leo: Except the book was written by witches with less powers than you guys have. They needed the spells.
Phoebe: Plus, I think if he was still alive, he probably would've attacked us again by now.
Prue: Ah, you know, Leo, can you just check to make sure, please? With the Elders?
Leo: No problem.
(Leo orbs out.)
Piper: If you ask me, I think you're being paranoid. We kicked Shax's behind. We bad.
Prue: Yes, you're probably right.
Phoebe: Then I'm hoping you won't need me around here for a while. I wanna try a new potion on Cole. One that'll reverse the spell that turned him bad in the first place.
Piper: Phoebe...
Phoebe: I'm not looking for your approval, Piper, just your support.
Prue: Well, Phoebe, it's sort of hard to give you support when you're just setting yourself up to get hurt again.
Phoebe: Cole is good inside, I know it. And if dark magic did this to him, then how come white magic can't save him? I can't just turn my back, I have to try.
Piper: What do you want us to do?
Phoebe: I want you to use the magic to magic spell to send me down there. I reworded it to make it work.
(Phoebe hands Piper a piece of paper.)
Piper: Uh, Phoebe, that's awfully dangerous. If something goes wrong we won't be able to contact each other.
Phoebe: I'll be safe, I'll be with Cole. And he'll bring me back, so don't worry about that.
Prue: You're banking a lot on that little potion of yours, you know.
Phoebe: No, I'm not. I'm banking on Cole. Source: All Hell Breaks Loose If Phoebe didn't trust Cole that much, none of this would've happened. Actually re-reading the script in order to post this, I no longer blame Leo. Once Phoebe did what she did, he had no choice. Remember this: [Scene: Outside the manor. There are now hundreds of people standing outside, holding cardboard signs. There are dozens of cameramen and news reporters. A helicopter flies above. Police are trying to get the crowd under control. Alice is standing on top of a van.]
Alice: (yelling) Prue, Piper, I'm one of you! I'm the only one who understands! I can help. Hey! Prue! Piper!
[Cut to inside the manor. Kitchen. Prue and Piper are there. Piper is looking through sheets of paper. Darryl walks in.]
Darryl: (on radio) Get those idiots off the driveway, get them back behind the tape.
Prue: Alright, what I can't figure out is how they knew that we were at the hospital. I-I mean, they didn't follow us.
Darryl: Reporter probably low jacked your car, followed you.
Prue: Forget it. You know, I really hope Phoebe's doing better down there than we are up here.
Piper: Look at all these interview requests we're getting. Ted Coppell, Time Magazine, Jerry Springer... Sports Illustrated?
Darryl: Yeah, they probably want you for the swimsuit edition. (Prue and Piper give him a dirty look.) Just kidding.
Prue: You know what? This is a nightmare. Where is Leo? (Prue sees Dr. Griffiths on the TV.) Uh, Piper? (Piper looks at the TV.) Is that who I think it is?
(Prue turns on the volume.)
Dr. Griffiths: (on TV) And then one of them said they needed a vanquishing spell.
Piper: Dr. Griffiths?
Dr. Griffiths: She ran upstairs to get some book. (Piper gasps.) I don't know, some witch-type book I guess. Something that told them how to kill that demon.
Piper: Oh, so much for keeping our secret. Turn him off.
(Prue changes the channel and a woman shows up.)
Woman: (on TV) The sisters were always a little strange if you ask me. I know for a fact that Prue once cast a spell to make my boyfriend break up with me. Evil.
Prue: Okay, Susie Johnson from tenth grade? They're interviewing her?
Piper: I always wondered why they broke up.
(Prue lightly hits Piper's arm.)
Prue: Not funny, not funny. Ooh! Leo. (Prue and Piper walk into the conservatory.) Leo! Leo! Leo! (Leo orbs in.) Ooh. Alright, this thing has to end now, okay? The media is turning it into a freakin' circus.
Leo: Now you know why the Elders have always been highly concerned about exposure.
Piper: Okey-dokey, now we know. Do they have any solutions or not?
Leo: One. But it's a long shot. You have to try and contact Tempus.
(Prue and Piper exchange looks.)
Prue: Uh, Tempus? T-Tempus, the demon?
Leo: He's the only one on the other side who has the power to manipulate time. To reset everything before this all started.
Prue: Okay, you're, you're definitely right, that-that qualifies as a long shot.
Piper: We vanquished him.
Leo: No, you defeated him, you didn't vanquish him. But that's not the real problem. The real trick is trying to contact him. He's an upper level demon who's well insulated.
Piper: And why would he want to help us? I mean, we can't make a move without the whole world tuning in to watch. We're basically powerless. Why would he want to change that?
(Suddenly, Alice bursts through the conservatory door.)
Prue/Piper: Whoa!
Alice: Cool, I made it!
Piper: Who the hell are you?
Alice: I'm Alice, Alice Hicks. I've been trying to contact you. I want to join your coven.
Prue: Are you nuts? This is our home! Get out of here!
(Prue uses her power on Alice and she flies outside.)
Alice: Ow!
(Darryl runs in wielding his gun.)
Darryl: All you stay back, all you stay back! (Darryl stops, confused. Prue stares at him.) You guys okay?
Prue: Yeah, we got it, Darryl. (to Leo) Alright, this has to end now or our lives are over!
[Cut to outside. Alice is walking down the driveway. Elana sees her.]
Elana: What happened? What did they do to you?
Elderly Man: Did they think you were a demon?
Elana: Did they think you were a joke?
Alice: They're mean witches!
(She wipes a tear off her face and walks away.)
[Cut to inside.]
Piper: Okay, so how do we contact Tempus?
Prue: Through Cole. He's an upper level demon, isn't he?
Piper: Why would he help us?
Prue: Because helping us helps Phoebe. Are you allowed to orb down there?
Leo: Yes, but I won't be able to find her until I'm down there. I can't track her from up here.
Prue: Alright, well, then you'd better hurry. (Leo doesn't go.) Okay, what's the matter?
Leo: Well, once I'm down there you won't be able to contact me if you get in any kind of trouble.
Piper: Honey, what more trouble could we possibly get in to? Besides, once time resets itself then everything should be fine. So go, and be careful.
Leo: Yeah, you too.
(Leo and Piper kiss and he orbs out.)
Piper: Okay, so what do you say? Oprah or Barbara? (Prue smiles.) Barbara makes you cry. We go with Oprah. Had Phoebe not done what she did, Leo would not have to go underground and be out of touch. It was truly all Phoebe's fault. And since so many fans think that it was Milano who got Doherty fired (I don't; I think Kern did - think of him as the Source, the true one who got rid of her by taking advantage of the situation Phoebe gave him), that just makes sense. Although since then I've come to realize that it was The WB that had Shannen fired - Kern wasn't the Source; he was Shax, the hatchetman, the same reason for most of the screwups in the latter seasons. |
|
|
|
Post by xchris on Nov 7, 2014 15:54:49 GMT -5
What do you mean? What is WB and Kern? I haven't watched the later seasons yet except of some random episodes on TV when i had no idea that the first 3 season were with Prue...i was thinking just about 1 season or something like that. And i liked the charmed ones... that is why i struggled to find a way and watch it on my computer. Everything was going fine till episode 22 from season 3... where i can't understand how they made such huge mistakes. And i am talking mostly about the part where they decided to hide almost everything and just show us Prue's funeral... someone who has watched episode 22 wouldn't even imagine that Prue died after what happened...anyway it kinda sucks but i will continue watching because it continues to be an amazing series in my opinion. They messed up an episode and did things in the worst way possible but that doesn't chgnge the fact that episodes with Paige are still interesting (tbh in my opinion Prue was a hundred times better... i don't know why but she just has that style that makes her amazing and i am talking about the way she is as an actress. Paige has talent too but there is a difference that is easy to tell). I read somewhere in this page someone suggesting that Prue should have continued in the season 4 too... it is an awesome idea. In my opinion the best way to do this would be Prue to continue till the Source appears to battle the charmed ones and then die from him... a real hardcore opponent, the one who is supposed to be a leader of all evil and definitely capable of killing her before he dies. Anyway that is just how i would love it to be. Maybe they didn't have a choise and they did it like this... idk because i don't know every detail. Also as you said in season 4 instead of having Paige we could have Phoebe in the underworld and Prue and Paiper trying to save her and survive without her till the final battle with the Source. I just can't understand how the ppl who managed to make something so awesome same time didn't manage to think of a good way to end it... when it is just too simple.
|
|
