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Post by Astral Echo on Dec 22, 2008 9:50:16 GMT -5
I agree, I don't believe Paige was born with TKO, I personally think she was only born with orbing and I think that in itself was a mistake that shouldn't of happened. Had Paige recieved orbing when the Elders were alerted to her existence, it would lead us to believe that all her powers were given to her by the Elders as she was a part whitelighter so like other whitelighters deserved the right to have whitelighter abilites.
On the other hand, she didn't die and like you Es, I believe being a whitelighter should be earned thus needing to die after living a "good" life.
At the end of the day, Paige was a spare of the moment mistake. Had her character been thought through, she could of been taken down two paths:
A. She recieved no powers at birth unlike her half sisters. As she is only part witch and the fact that she was part whitelighter messed with her generic make up. The part of a witch that enables them to have abilities was written off by her whitelighter side, instead she was only able to cast spells and make potions and as she wasn't aware of that, she never actually "activated" that side of her either. After Prue's death and uniting with her sisters, the Elders were made aware of her existence - they gave her a few whitelighter abilites including orbing and telekinesis.
They did this as they needed the Charmed legacy to live on and now that they had the chance, they needed to give her powers to be able to protect herself. Even though she was brought into the world "illegally", she was needed and the Elders accepted that. However, though she was given orbing she was never able to recieve any other whitelighter powers as she couldn't fufill that destiny until after her death.
B. Paige was born with telekinetic orbing, a witch power that was mixed up by her whitelighter roots. She didn't recieve orbing as that is scrictly a whitelighter ability and as she can't become a whitelighter until after death, she didn't get it and neither did the Elders give it to her.
Paige joined her sisters and reconsituated the power of three, becoming aware to her powers. As she wasn't aware of her witchy heritage she never knew about her powers thus never used them.
I just wish they had thought about it. *sigh*
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Esmeralda
Charmed
S2 "What If...?"
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Twenty Years Gone....But Never Forgotten.
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Post by Esmeralda on Dec 22, 2008 10:28:59 GMT -5
I do, too.
Although after reading yours and thinking about it, I think that had they thought it out, they would've had Paige born with the same Warren TK that Prue had, the way Chris was, even if it means that she would only be able to replace Prue in the Power of Three. But if the other sisters were born with their powers, the way Chris was, and if his being a half-whitelighter didn't prevent him from having it right away (I don't count the Twice-Blessed Brat, since his should've-never-happened-prophecy screws up him), then Paige should've, too. And if Nicholas didn't know about her (and if the Elders and the Demons didn't...) she should've had it even before she was Charmed--there would've been no reason to bind hers, the reason she was able to orb from the accident. The fact that she had TK (the lost prophesied powers once Prue was dead) and was a half-sister through the Warren side is what should've allowed her to become Charmed, but not while Prue was alive.
Although I hate the idea of a male having Warren powers (being a witch, fine; having Warren powers, no), I have to admit that they did Chris proper as half-whitelighter--having both orbing (whitelighter) and TK (Warren), not a combination thereof. The fact that Paige's TK/O is the ONLY whitelighter-modified power tells me that even KERN knew that he'd screwed up with that one.
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Post by Fourever Charmed on Dec 22, 2008 13:18:43 GMT -5
And what you wrote, 4Ever, shows the same thing. According to what you wrote, had Phoebe or Piper been the one who died, then Paige could not have become Charmed, because as a half-whitelighter she only had TK--she couldn't replace Piper or Phoebe. So are you saying that if Prue hadn't been the one who died that Paige would not have been able to be Charmed, because she wouldn't have the prophesied power to reconstitute the Charmed Ones? No, I don't think that makes sense. It would make more sense that at the time that she was Charmed, she would receive the power of the Charmed One she replaces, modified  by her whitelighter side. And there would be no reason for her to become Charmed as long as the three original Charmed Ones were still alive. No, I'm sorry, your argument of TK passing from Prue to Paige makes no sense and there's no evidence of it anywhere in the series. I've already stated in my first post that I believe there was pre-destiny at work. Prue was meant to die and Paige was meant to replace her, hence the reason Paige was born with TKO. If Piper or Phoebe had been meant to die, Paige would've been more with some type of "freezing" or prophetic powers, but instead, Prue was meant to die. |
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Esmeralda
Charmed
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Twenty Years Gone....But Never Forgotten.
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Post by Esmeralda on Dec 22, 2008 13:43:47 GMT -5
Yup, I figured that out after I posted that. That's why I changed my last post to reflect that--even if I don't think predestination had anything to do with Charmed outside of Melinda Warren's ORIGINAL prophecy. I don't think Melinda Warren could've predicted one of the sisters dying and the need for a fourth or it would've been part of the prophecy--she only predicted THREE sisters, not four. No way Melinda Warren could've predicted Patty screwing her whitelighter and having a baby--such things wouldn't even be considered during her time. With Patty having done that and with Paige ending up with TK, rather than predestination they very simply lucked out.
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Post by Astral Echo on Dec 22, 2008 13:51:43 GMT -5
See I like my A scenrio. I think it would of been really interesting to get into more detail about the genetics of "magic" and how it's passed on etc...
And I believe it would of been interesting to see a Charmed One that doesn't actually have any powers and proving that to be a witch, you don't have to have powers. Like CRR's Piper. On top of, we would of seen how weak the Elders really are, us having the knowledge that they know that they need the sisters.
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Esmeralda
Charmed
S2 "What If...?"
Fan Fic Winner
Twenty Years Gone....But Never Forgotten.
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Post by Esmeralda on Dec 22, 2008 14:06:22 GMT -5
And I think the genetics is as boring as giving powers huge fancy-sounding names when it's simply moving things with your mind, freezing stuff, and getting to see the future--who cares why it works, just so it always works the same way, which was why they had to have all the fancy-sounding names to explain why it didn't always work the same way. Especially when the fancy-sounding names and pseudo-genetics is used for coming up with totally unnecessary extra powers, like astral projection, molecular combustion (the worst of the bunch), levitiation, empathy, cyrokinetic and all the other fancy names.
If it's truly magic, who needs an explanation? That's what stops it from being magic!
I would prefer mine. It would make it a lot more simpler and be in touch with what they obviously thought was the best way since that's how they handled Chris, having a witch power and a whitelighter power and to heck with a combined power.
I never thought I'd actually agree with something Kern did, but in this case, since he was fixing his own HUGE mistake, I will.
Best of all, had they not done the combined-power crap, then the emphasis would've remained on relationships and the fact that Paige was their half-sister, not on her screwed-up powers (or a way to cover up Rose's horrible acting "talents".)
But naturally it's just all opinion. That's the best part of all of Kern's screwups; it makes it fun to try to make sense out of them.
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Post by CharmedFaith on Dec 22, 2008 15:50:33 GMT -5
The thing is though, before the writers went all disney on us, TKO had never been used by anyone else in the show and it was strictly a Paige power (except for the guardian of the hollow which was a mistake). If her telekinesis had been from her whitelighter side, it would not have been mixed. It would have just been whitelighter TK like Leo had. But since she inherited TK from the Warren line, her body was basically confused about which side should be dominate, the whitelighter half won out thus her telekinesis merging with her whitelighterness bringing about TKO.
But my idea and mixing it mostly from Charmed Reset Reality, Paige was a mistake and when she was born the grand design basically got messed up and went all Final Destination on Prue, Piper, and Phoebe, trying to kill one of them off to make room for Paige but the sisters always avoided death until time was reset. And Paige would take up whichever sister died. CRR goes on with Piper giving up her Charmed status and Paige recieving a "time" power thus making everything right with the world again.
This is how CRR goes about it fully
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Esmeralda
Charmed
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Post by Esmeralda on Dec 22, 2008 16:02:47 GMT -5
And that's the way they're doing it and it works for them.
It just doesn't work for me. Had Paige had straight TK and not become Charmed until something happened for one of the others to no longer be Charmed (Prue dying and then Piper offering herself and thanks to that, she's allowed to live but loses her powers while Paige has her TK taken away and is given straight freezing instead) and had they gotten rid of the whole Twice Blessed prophecy crap with their twins only being twice blessed due to having a whitelighter for a dad and a witch for a mom like Paige rather than the Twice Blessed Twins, and had their Chris who is supposed to be pure whitelighter only have the whitelighter version of TK, not the Warren version, then I'd agree that they're righting the wrongs. But all of these that should've been fixed were instead made worse, especially Paige who during their S4 is their version of Billie--boring, too-powerful, hogs too much screen time and is totally unnecessary, none of which describes Paige on the show. With Piper no longer having powers, Paige is necessary, but she's still too powerful and still hogs too much screen time. C:RR is truly THE PAIGE SHOW STARRING KALEY CUCOA AS PAIGE MATTHEWS featuring Shannen Doherty, Holly Marie Combs and Alyssa Milano. When Paige shows up, I skim passed the scene, the same way I would with Billie if I were watching S8.
Just my opinion, of course, but...
I highly recommend their series. Their plots are fantastic. The fact that they're able to put out an episode every week is amazing. The fact that they are on their third season is mind-boggling. Their original characters are my favorite characters on the show, much more than the Charmed Ones or their family (I'm waiting for their Phoenix spin-off--that should SO rock!) All of the other wrongs they've righted they did a fantastic job with.
But this bit with the witchlighters rather than half-whitelighters is something that should've been fixed and is instead made much worse, allowing Paige to be the most powerful sister, even more than Piper on the show and the Twins even more powerful than S6 Chris.
And I would not have brought this up if you didn't mention C:RR.
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Post by Fourever Charmed on Dec 22, 2008 16:20:20 GMT -5
Although I hate the idea of a male having Warren powers (being a witch, fine; having Warren powers, no), I have to admit that they did Chris proper as half-whitelighter--having both orbing (whitelighter) and TK (Warren), not a combination thereof. The fact that Paige's TK/O is the ONLY whitelighter-modified power tells me that even KERN knew that he'd screwed up with that one. I would prefer mine. It would make it a lot more simpler and be in touch with what they obviously thought was the best way since that's how they handled Chris, having a witch power and a whitelighter power and to heck with a combined power. Both Chris and SuperBrat had TKO. The first sign of Chris's TKO was in "It's A Bad, Bad, Bad, Bad World, Part One" when Evil Chris dark orbs the gun from Darryl. Because Evil Chris is a mirror of good Chris, that means good Chris also had TKO. This was confirmed in "Kill Billie: VOL 2" when Baby Chris orbed the card while Wyatt and Victor were playing Candyland and again after Dumain kidnaps Wyatt and steals his powers and Chris orbs him back to the playpen upon Victor's request. ETA: This is something that's always ticked me off, too. I don't believe Warren boys should have witch powers in the first place. I also hated the fact that the writers got lazy and decided to just give everyone TKO, because I loved how unique Paige's power was when it was first introduced.  |
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Post by CharmedFaith on Dec 22, 2008 18:53:52 GMT -5
I have always been boderline with the whole Warren boys shouldnt have powers. Part of me agrees, but then part of me disagrees. Frankly I think no males shouldve been born in the warren line in the first place and if one was then it would be something really special and only happen once in a couple of decades in which I would be fine with them having powers.
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by her whitelighter side. And there would be no reason for her to become Charmed as long as the three original Charmed Ones were still alive.
